it does happen
I knew someone whos dog would ONLY eat fresh veg&fruit. The owners kept offering him raw meat and cooked food but he would refuse it each time.
I do even know a raw vegan cat :)
Some pets CAN take care of themselves.
Our cat eats a cooked vegan diet... has for over three years, and the vet is amazed at how healthy she is!
i would interested in a raw vegan diet for her, but with the highly acidic digestive system of cats, i'm not sure that raw would be markedly better for her. I'll use the Search function and see what I can find
Obsessively, fanatically, gung-ho efforts to live a moderate, mellow life...
I am weaning my dog off of meat at the moment. He's on his way to being a raw "lacto-ovo" veggie, but without the milk. So maybe a raw ovo vegetarian?
Goodness, I don't know.
I just know that he will still get eggs, but I'm cutting out the part of his diet that is contributing to inhumane practices. I think that getting free-range, organic eggs is the best compromise to play it safe with his health.
He's been eating a lot more veggies lately, many of them in the form of dehydrated patties that are shaped like burgers. He LOVES them. I've been making homemade dog bones too. He's in Spoiled Doggie Heaven right now. :)
'Structure equals function' keeps going through my head from high school bio.
In other words, why would dogs have such massive canine teeth if not for being able to chew meat?
Azaria -- that's a great question. It makes sense. Dogs don't really chew meat in the same way no matter what, not when they are domesticated. Even when I was giving my dog raw bones, he did not do much chewing. I never understood how he could wolf things down so easily!
In nature, he would need to have sharp teeth to chew on an entire animal.
I do know that the acid in a dog's stomach is much stronger than a human stomach, which is why UNcooked meat and UNcooked eggs are digested easily.
As a house dog, he gets rawhides and chews on his poor stuffed animal. It is what it is. I was not so educated about these issues when I got my dog 8 years ago. I will enjoy him until he is not with us, then he will be my last dog. That's just my personal choice, and I respect others who are out getting a puppy today. :)
Feeding your cat a vegan diet is feline abuse.
Originally Posted by RaeVynn
Cats cannot get adequate nutrition from plant foods. That is the general consensus in the medical profession based on a cat's digestive system. They have teeth made for shearing and a short digestive tract. They are inveterate carnivores. I cannot even believe this is even being seriously broached.
Dogs are different, they're omnivorous.
I agree it is a constant dillema when you are a animal-loving vegan to feed your cats meat! But ultimately, after testing this theory out, I really believe cats need meat. They not only need it, they REALLY thrive on it. I promise you, if you start feeding your cat raw cat food, made from meat, you will notice a difference.
I have five cats, and I make all my own raw cat food from www.catnutrition.org.
If you have never read that site, it's worth a read. Lots of testimonials on real-life health improvements when feeding cats raw cat food made from meat. One of the major ones is IBS (irritable bowel syndrome) in cats will usually clear up within three days of eating raw. Also a much higher percentage of the food is digested leaving much less cat poo in the cat pan. Also, cat poo does not smell!! Awesome benefit! No more stinky cat pans. (with five cats, that's a huge benefit)
But I have to say each time I grind up all the chicken in my meat grinder it gives me the willies!!
I second, third and fourth those who talk about a cat's need for meat. Because of their biological build, they can't get the nutrition they need from non-meat based sources. That's not an opinion, it's simply they way they evolved.
Is feeding them a raw diet disturbing? It can be. In fact, I think one of the most difficult aspects of feeding raw here in the US is the "ick" factor. For many folks, that "ick" factor is stronger than their desire to feed their pets a species-appropriate diet, and so their next best option (and it's still leaps and bounds better than kibble) is a grain-free canned diet. There's nothing wrong with that at all.
But you can't feed a cat a diet of foods it can't process and think it'll be ok. It's like putting water in a gas tank and thinking you're going to get to work just fine. In this case, as extreme as it may sound - if your emotional, spiritual or philosophical state will not allow you to feed your cat anything but a vegetarian diet, don't get a cat.
Hmmm, I just realized the original post was about a vegan-fed dog, and so the above is a bit off-topic, sorry! Of course, dogs evolved as omnivores, not herbivores, so my post would be the same whether we're talking about a cat or a dog. If you can't, for whatever reason, meet a pet's basic physical needs, then you should get a different type of pet.
That's not mean or being a hater or an oppressor, it's just taking your philosophical viewpoint - caring for one and all - and extending it to cover your potential pet.
Last edited by Auntie Crazy; 02-08-2009 at 05:25 PM.
Auntie Crazy & Crew: Allen, Rachel, Meghan, Spencer, Heather, and Oliver (RIP)
Firstly, dogs normally do not chew on their food. Their front teeth are designed to grab and hold their prey. The back teeth are meant to cut through the meat, but definitely not chew it. They wolf down whole pieces and thier stomach does all the work of "chewing" it by digesting it, hence the stronger stomach acid. You can relate it to snakes. Snakes have a very very strong stomach acid so they can digest whole prey items. Dogs are similiar in that they can swallow whole pieces of meat that they tear off the prey. They chew on bones since these cannot be swallowed as easy, and they can get to the tasty (to them anyway) marrow inside. My dachshund Bailey, LOVES pork ribs.
Second, cats should not be on a vegetarian, much less a vegan diet. It is cruel since their bodies cannot get proper nutrition from such a diet. It is like a human living only on meat. It can lead to a lot of problems. If you cannot stand your can eating meat, then please reconsider having a cat. I am a vegan. I love animals of all kinds, but because of my decision to share my home with carnivorous animals, they eat meat. I have 4 ferrets, 4 cats, and a small dog, and all will be switched to a raw meat diet (the ferrets already are.) I have seen great improvement in the animals when they have raw meat.
A) My ferret, Twitch was underweight, and didn't have a lot of energy. Her poop smelled horribly and was always a nasty color (looked like the mashed up version of what she ate) I switched her and her siblings to a completely raw diet, including raw meaty bones, organ meat, and boneless meats. She began gaining weight back, fur became softer, energy increased, she pooped less, and it smelled half as bad.
B) My cat's teeth were horrible. Ramman, my 13lb cat (at the time he was 13lbs and only 9-10 months old) had gingivites. The other cats were heading that way. I fed them strictly a raw meat diet (identical to the ferret's diet in every way except portion size). Ramman's teeth and gums improved and his weight stabalized. The other cats gained energy and I've never seen them so excited over dinner time.
We will use a ferret's digestive system as an example of why cats should have a raw meat diet (they are almost identical). Ferrets have a short digestive system. It is meat to digest and elimiate quickly, all the while getting as much nutrition from the meat as possible. Their teeth, much like a dogs or cats, is meant to grab and tear meat, and swallow quickly (the moist nature of meat, allows it to be swallowed in large chunks easily). Upon entering the digestive system, the meat is digested at a fast rate and eliminated. The digestive process of a ferret can take as little as a few hours. The bacteria on the meat doesn't have time to take hold in the ferret's stomach so the threat of meat born illness is rare for ferrets. This goes for cats and dogs as well, as they also have a strong, short, digestive system. Because they are strict carnivores, ferrets (and cats) can get all the nutrients they need from meat, connective tissues, organs, and bone. When fed a kibble diet, strict carnivores have a hard time getting a lot of nutrients out of kibble due to the high plant content and the food is eliminated far too soon and it comes out looking similar to the way it went in. (this is especially true in ferrets). With a raw meat diet, ferrets (and cats) can get all the nutrients needed from meat since their digestive system is designed to digest and utilize such nutrients. Therefore, deficating occurs with larger spans of time between each one and the feces smells less. With ferrets especially, eating a kibble diet can lead to a number of illnesses including adrenal disease which is more often than not caused by malnutrition of eating kibble.
Sorry for the long rant. I've done a lot of research about raw diets for ferrets and it applies to cats as well as both are strict carnivores. Please do your cat a favor and switch him/her to a raw meat diet. NEVER feed a vegetarian diet or vegan diet to a ferret. You will kill them by doing so.
My personal update on this -- I saw only one change in the short time of feeing my dog vegetarian with eggs -- more poop! (A LOT more)
I have been doing more reading of my own on this and decided to seek out an alternative. I had been buying antibiotic-etc-free stuff from Target that I didn't really trust. I talked to my local, organic grocer about this issue. The owners actually check the local farms where they get their meat, and they go out to make sure the conditions are good for the animals. I trust this store -- it's been around for a long time and is not a big chain. The meat is more expensive, but it's the best (additional) compromise I can think of.
So, I'm still feeding some of the patties, but Boli's getting ONE big chicken leg each day. Funny -- a lot of humans would benefit from a diet as thought out as my dog's diet.