My turn to ask a silly question!

[Rawkinlocs]

Okay, so we all (or mostly all) feel as though cooking foods beyond a certain temperature destroys the nutrients, destroys the enzymes and if there ARE any nutrients left in the food, they are not easily assimilated by our bodies... is this correct?

Okay, if so, then please tell me why we always feel that leaving a cooked food diet and going for a raw food diet means we are now more suseptible of being deficient?

I mean, what nutrients did the cooked food diet provide that are supposedly lost when we abandon said diet?

Is the reason for thinking that raw fooders (or even cooked vegetarians/vegans for that matter) are more prone to deficiency because we tend to eat LESS or is it because we are no longer eating (COOKED) meat and dairy products?

Somebody help me out here because this is really daunting to keep hearing about raw fooders feeling the need to take this supplement or that powder to supplement something that supposedly was never there to begin with (assuming the whole "cooked food is void of nutrients/cooked food is poison" theory is true).

Thanks

P.S. Please know that I am not trying to offend anyone or put down those members who are currently taking supplements or protein powders. I am merely asking this question for my own knowledge and clarity based on the things I mentioned above.

[tglasco4]

I hear ya Sis,
I don't believe I need ANYTHING other than the food itself. Fruit, veggies, nuts and seeds. Plenty of fresh water. Sunshine and clean air. Lots of Faith. No supplements (I just recently stopped taking them), no powders or anything else for me. The only folks I know that preach about a body needing supplements or dairy or meat are either (1) Representing one of those industries for profit, (2) Has fear as a result of the tremendous marketing campaign for (1) or (3) means well and is just ignorant to the truth. What we were given as a diet originally is still the best diet. It does take time to let the body adjust to being fed poison for decades, which is why many never hang around long enough or are patient enough to find out. I have only been doing mostly raw for 5 months and although I have had tremendous results in terms of health, I expect my body to continue adjusting for the next couple of years. One day I will crave all raw and my body will reject any cooked food and that will come as naturally as the change of seasons.

Peace.

Todd

Okay, so we all (or mostly all) feel as though cooking foods beyond a certain temperature destroys the nutrients, destroys the enzymes and if there ARE any nutrients left in the food, they are not easily assimilated by our bodies... is this correct?

Okay, if so, then please tell me why we always feel that leaving a cooked food diet and going for a raw food diet means we are now more suseptible of being deficient?

I mean, what nutrients did the cooked food diet provide that are supposedly lost when we abandon said diet?

Is the reason for thinking that raw fooders (or even cooked vegetarians/vegans for that matter) are more prone to deficiency because we tend to eat LESS or is it because we are no longer eating (COOKED) meat and dairy products?

Somebody help me out here because this is really daunting to keep hearing about raw fooders feeling the need to take this supplement or that powder to supplement something that supposedly was never there to begin with (assuming the whole "cooked food is void of nutrients/cooked food is poison" theory is true).

Thanks

[Rawkinlocs]

Thanks Todd!

[nobletroll]

Quick answer we are brained washed.

During the middle ages it was thought that taking a bath often could cause one to be ill and drinking water was not healthy. Both ideals had some bases in fact, water born illness due to human waste being dumped into the same water they drank and bathed in could cause illness, but those acts did not cause illness. Eating uncooked meat can make you sick from the parasites and diseases they carry. When animal waste is put on plants without composting (this is not aloud for organic foods) organisms from that waste can be harmful. The problem is not eating the food raw. The solution is not in cooking the food to kill the bad organisms it is farming the right way, which is what most organic farmers do. If an organic farmer dos not farm the right way he has crop problems and doesn't make money. If a factory farmer doesn't farm in the correct way he sprays his crop with pesticides that jest make the bad organisms stronger.

People are looking for reasons to keep eating cooked food. ItÂ’s like the addict making up reasons to keep using. There are toxins made in cooking foods, and I believe we are addicted to those toxins. The reason you are getting are jest excuses to justify that addiction.

[mwjeepster]

Like your name ;) ! I tend to agree, that if in fact whole raw foods have everything we need, then we don't need supplements - I think the need might arise with people like me who don't eat a good variety of foods - which is not to say we did so when we were eating cooked, but we're not going for a little bit of better health here, we're going for over-the-top, blow your brains out fabulous health - the kind of health that very few of us have probably ever experienced. So while I'm drinking a green drink every day, and trying to mix up different greens in the process, there are certain veggies you will not find me in the same room with therefore, I may be a good candidate for shapeshift, etc. because I really would like the benefit of really being in great health. Oh, and Noble, I believe in the times you are referring to, the earth was considered flat!!!

Love to all,
Melissa

[ehartmanf]

What a great discussion. I try to get a good variety of fruits and vegetables, but I always did, even when I was eating cooked. I'm always looked for new and different things I've never had before. Right now I'm searching for persimmons. Can't find them here yet.

Today I juiced carrots, apple, celery, beet and collard greens together. It tasted amazing and was so energizing. I don't think I need any supplements to help me achieve and maintain good health, but they probably wouldn't hurt either.

I've been thinking about trying a little hemp protein in my smoothies.....

[Rawkinlocs]

Thanks for your replies thus far all!

I guess what I'm trying to understand is the thinking I've found from some raw fooders on various sites that seems to imply that by no longer eating a cooked food diet, we are now missing out on something by eating all raw foods.

I'm wondering how this is possible IF the nutrients in cooked foods are allegedly null and void, meaning, we must have already BEEN deficient on the S.A.D. (or standard cooked diet for those who are not IN America! ;) ) and that now that we're eating these live foods we should be getting what we need.

Also, one other question: The statement, "Our soil is depleted"...is that even really true, or is that another ploy of the "big guys" to make sure we spend money on various vitamins such as One A Day or Centrum, etc.? This is a retorical question...I'm just giving some food for thought here. As I heard it said one day, if our soil was THAT depleted, then the fruits and veggies wouldn't even grow and/or survive.

[monkeyboy]

Rawkinlocs,

I hear you loud and clear.

"Raw fooders don't get enough nutrients"...... "Thier diets are limited". We hear this all the time.

Let's face it, a guy who eats cooked food has limits to his diet too. Bacon and eggs for breakfast, cheeseburger and fries for lunch, and pasta with cream sauce for dinner, all washed down with a few beers.


Give me the nutritional facts on that diet.

The brainwashing must stop.

Raw foods is the way to go. Eat as much a variety as you can. How can you loose going raw. You still need to think about what you are eating, but it's much better than cooked food guy.


Peace and Knife safety,


M.B.

[marigold]

i certainly dont believe that on raw we are getting less than on cooked..i think we get more!! but something isnt right that lots on raw are getting ill and deficent - dont know why - not eating a balanced diet ? but its not something imo that we can ignore...

i dont beleive we can get all we need from any way of eating.- cos yeah the soil is crap these days..how can we ? and of cours there is the b12 issue too...

i take some superfoods and i have to say the day i did that i felt so much better..i look on superfoods as an insurance policy..it covers me for the times i cant face my greens for example or when i dont eat as well as i could..ok not ideal but them we dont live in an ideal world do we ?

[lil]

The debates on other raw food boards that I have seen about deficiencies in raw eating have been around b-12 and calcium/magnesium. Sometimes the debates get rather heated!. And there seems to be an equal amount of debate between those who see it as an issue to those who say it's an non-issue.
I think the soil errosion issue is true - raw food is not as full of nutrients as it once was. And most of the raw foods we eat are hybrids - I don't think there is any original raw food left (a sad thought...). I've heard there may be some original apples left - but likely not available to consumers.
As to supplements - I think they may be useful when your transitioning to raw or if you are ill. But I don't think someone should become dependent on them or use them as a meal replacement.
There's some people on raw food boards that are really into micro-managing their diet. They measure and map out every possible nutrient in every bite of food. And some try to analysis other's diets and announce they are "potassium" deficient or have some other deficiency. *Yawn*
I expect it won't be long before mainstream (S.A.D.) nutritionists denounce the raw food diet as nutritionally unsound (maybe they already have...?)

[Jeanne]

I've been thinking about your question. One of the things that people (including myself) might make people think 'deficiencies' is symptoms. In the past with the SAD and other 'diets' people get symptoms and then they _take_ something to get rid of them. I am reading the book, The Detox Miracle Sourcebook by Rober Norse N.D.
He really has brought my thinking around to what typical western medicine overlooks and misinterperets as symptoms. In the standard approach the view is, when a symptom occurs, something is taken and then when the symptom disappears, health is resumed. In the Detox Miracle a symptom is a sign of the body working to cope or eliminate some overload or imbalance and the general perscription is to do nothing, let the temperature burn the offender out, let the mucous drain.
When people start raw foods, detox starts, and symptoms of detox appear and people often think something is wrong.
Also, the body seems to start absorbing so much better that when a dietary discretion happens, there are often quick results of discomfort of one kind or another. The body can't handle the 'wide path' of, "Oh, just for tonight, I'll go back to my healthier eating tomorrow."
I have had some things pop up that I have had to wonder which it is, lack or detox. Before raw I had a host of symptoms that all pointed to lack. The Detox Miracle book is helping me identify what system was (and still is in some cases) deficient and why, but the cure is always the same....raw foods... especially fruit for it's cleansing properties. So patience has replaced fear, and I am being good to myself (as of last week) giving myself the rest I need when episodes of detox appear. I am listening to myself more closely too and not pushing past subtle messages with my standard-operating-procedure lifestyle I used to think nothing twice about.
I will say that there are certain symptoms that occur that do signal something needed, like cracks at the corners of the mouth indicate more greens. This happened to me and one large meal of greens and the next day the cracks were gone.
The past few days I am following the 80-10-10 (80% fruit-10%veg, 10% fat) appraoch. This has made it easy for me to make sure I am getting all I need. I am feeling very good and balanced on this. I am able to really intuit what my body needs. I know there was a thread about the impossibility of staying on this for any length of time, but the key is in quantity of food, people don't realize that the amount is key to success. I have been counting the calories while I adjust to this, and left to my own, typical choices I would be eating around 700 calories a day. Other's have noticed this too. So no wonder after a while people would feel drained! I am doubling my menu now, don't need to count the calories anymore.
I do expect odd symptoms of detox to pop now. I have read that the body exhibits symptoms of past ailments as those things that caused the issue are passing through on the way out. So I won't be shocked and wonder what to do to stop it. Depending on what it is I may rest more and/or take just juices or maybe a water fast to give the body the focus to do what it has to do without having to digest as well.
Thanks for starting such a great thread!!

[Rawkinlocs]

Thanks again everyone. I am really enjoying reading your responses to my question(s)! Jeanne, I REALLY appreciate you sharing what you've learned in that book...I must get it!

See, this is what I'm talking about, precisely what you said...that when we switch from cooked (and/or the SAD) that we experience discomforts of detox and where we used to believe that we must take something or go running to the doctor, patience and continuing on the path will make all better.

This is why I got SO frustrated reading a certain article that said detox shouldn't last more than a few months. How on God's green earth can we expect to have abused our bodies and eaten crap most/all of our lives and then the detox is supposed to only last a short while. We spent YEARS putting all this garbage in, so it should be expected to take a while to get it all out of our systems. This is just my take on it...again, I'm not a professional...it just seems like common sense to me. <=== That was just me ranting, btw.

Again, thanks for all replies!


One more quick question for anyone who cares to answer!

Okay, so if our soil is depleted and the fruits and veggies we consume don't have all that they once had in them...where do the vitamins, nutrients, minerals, etc. in SUPPLEMENTS come from? Where are they derived from?

I've asked this before (not sure if it was here or where it was...can't remember). Thanks!

[marigold]

good question rawkins..there is a difference between supplements and superfoods though isnt there ? guess superfoods just have more powerful nutrients in than say an apple.

what you say makes sence bout detoxing taking so long but them i know people have been ill for years or months and going oh its detox when in fact its not..

this oh detox this and that and raw is so wonderful worries me really - i feel we need the balance rather than the raw food MOVEMENT..where i see a lot of scarey behavour..illness and deficiancy being ignored..and wimmin with almost like eating disorders "trying to keep raw"

now who is having a rant!!! i think raw is great and we need balance.

[Rawkinlocs]

good question rawkins..there is a difference between supplements and superfoods though isnt there ? guess superfoods just have more powerful nutrients in than say an apple.

what you say makes sence bout detoxing taking so long but them i know people have been ill for years or months and going oh its detox when in fact its not..

this oh detox this and that and raw is so wonderful worries me really - i feel we need the balance rather than the raw food MOVEMENT..where i see a lot of scarey behavour..illness and deficiancy being ignored..and wimmin with almost like eating disorders "trying to keep raw"

now who is having a rant!!! i think raw is great and we need balance.

Hiya Marigold! Thanks for your reply and I do really understand what you are saying. But again, the question comes to mind, where is the "deficiency" stemming from? Is it because they are not eating enough? Not eating a variety of different things (eating all fruit and no veggies or all nuts and no fruit or all veggies and no nuts?). How can one NOT be classified as deficient when they were on the cooked food diet and now all of a sudden after being on a raw food diet, they're deficient?

Also, I think that many of us still have the wrong idea about what disease and illness is and what causes it. I've read in Shelly Keck-Borsit's book "Dying to Get Well" (located at http://dyingtogetwell.com) that there is ONE cause for disease - autointoxication (or plainly put, the body self-poisoning itself due to toxins that it can't eliminate properly) and that there is ONE cure for disease - getting the toxins out of the body...cleaning it on the inside...eliminating the cause of the toxins (food, environment, etc.).

If you haven't already, please read this (very lengthy) article and tell me what you think. http://www.neohygiene.com/excerpt.html

If raw fooders are no longer putting toxic-producing foods into their bodies, then their "illness" has to be either detox or (in "some" cases if they're not eating the RIGHT kinds/variations of raw food) deficiency.

And again, even with superfoods...where does this stuff COME from? Who's producing it? HOW are they producing it and what is the source?

Sea vegetation? Why can't we just include kelp or dulse or nori into our diets then? I do. B12 supplements? B12 has something to do with "good" bacteria, right? I say that because sometimes I use nutrional yeast flakes and it's said that it's an excellent source of B12 and that this nutritional yeast is grown from bacteria on a certain type of molasses. I've read that our own bodies produce and recycle B12 (I guess a healthy body, that is).

I'm not arguing with you by any means Marigold...in fact, this post isn't directly only to you, but to anyone reading because these are things that I think should be taken into consideration.

Allow me to give this example and I'm gonna shut up for a while 'cause I tend to get "long-winded" at times!

When I was eating the SAD (or standard cooked food diet), I was diagnosed as being anemic. I was ALWAYS tired and lethargic with no energy whatsoever. I had to take naps and was always cold.

Now, doctors had me taking iron supplements (which made me sick) to combat the problem.

Since having gone (high) raw, I have noticed that I no longer need naps (unless I stay up too late the night before and get up early as I normally do!), I'm not cold anymore and I just feel better than I EVER felt taking those supplements.

So the point of my little story? That what was considered a deficiency and prescribed supplements only needed a change in my diet and my body to be cleaned out.

I think that this will ever be a debatable subject, but it's nice to hear the differing views. In the end, we all have to listen to our own bodies and follow our own paths!

[elwaytaffy]

Here is my silly question...I keep hearing about 'superfoods'. What exactly are superfoods? Thanks!