just read natural hygiene site.....

[Bingka]

They are completely against a raw vegan diet. They are also against veganism and vegetarians. They post a few examples (in there words) of how bad our diets are. Mostly knocking the hallelujeah acres diet. They even use Jane Goodall to prove we must eat meat.

Some of the stuff was B-12 deficiency, lack of muscle, etc. They are trying to build a huge case against raw food and veganism.

I don't know any long term raw fooders (30+ years) that can prove this is the right way to eat, but it feels that way to me. I will continue to eat this way and enjoy all the benefits I feel.

What are your opinions on the Natural Hygienists ways?

Ken

[goodbeets]

Dear Bingka, I to have done a lot of internet research in to a raw diet vs. many others. One of the best I've found is beyondveg.com. Mostly what I have come to believe is that a 100% raw food diet is cleansing and stabilizing and THEN you, your individual body, will let you know what is balanced for you. I think their is a lot to our genetics, our 3 million years of genetics. That a raw food diet might work perfectly well but you might eat lots of fruits and I might eat lots of veg to feel comforortable. Some people will feel best with a bit of raw dairy products, some with grass fed beef or wild fish. I find lots of people saying they have the perfect way that is perfect for all of us and that has never sat well. I do not need a guru, teachers, yes at times, but otherwise my own soul, body, heart and mind is my best teacher. Keep doing whats best for you and do research.

[goodbeets]

One more thing, I read a great book a while ago, "Ishmael" by Daniel Quinn, and one thing it restarted for me is the extremely recent introduction of a grain-based diet into humanity. I think that that may be the biggest link; too much grain and overly processed grain. In "The Maker's Diet", the author says that, years ago, communities would harvest their grains and leave it outside for a day or 2 which would facilitate sprouting of the grains. I don't know if they know they are doing that.

[StudentforLife]

Wow! I'm surprised a natural hygien site is against raw or vegitarian.

I'm assuming it's just this one particular site...right??

I would be interested to find out who runs this particular site.

[Frecs]

They are completely against a raw vegan diet. They are also against veganism and vegetarians. They post a few examples (in there words) of how bad our diets are. Mostly knocking the hallelujeah acres diet. They even use Jane Goodall to prove we must eat meat.

Some of the stuff was B-12 deficiency, lack of muscle, etc. They are trying to build a huge case against raw food and veganism.

I don't know any long term raw fooders (30+ years) that can prove this is the right way to eat, but it feels that way to me. I will continue to eat this way and enjoy all the benefits I feel.

What are your opinions on the Natural Hygienists ways?

Ken

I'd be interested in reading the site, what is the address?

You want my opinion, for what it's worth?

I think that since the human body (as opposed to other species) can not generate it's own B12 and can only get B12 from animal sources and must have B12 for proper functioning logic would say that we should be eating a diet with animal protein in it. How much B12 is needed is quite variable amongst humans and yes I have read testimonies of people who have gone decades without B12 supplementation. B12 is a huge controversy in the vegan world probably because it is the biggest strick against veganism as a healthy diet.

I think that to say that the raw diet is bad because some are too thin or lack muscle is ridiculous. Look at the population of SAD eaters -- you have people who are too thin and lack muscle there too...plus morbidly obese people. One should not use demographics as an argument for or against a diet. The diet should be evaluated on it's own merits in terms of providing proper nutrition. So, raw in whatever form or fashion should only be evaluated based on how well it does or does not provide all the necessary nutrients to the human body.

Compared to my SAD days, my raw vegan diet is much much healthier. No, I won't remain vegan forever...just while I lose weight...but I'll never go back to SAD.

[Bingka]

Here is the site. It claims to be the Natural hygiene organization...

Natural Hygiene Organization

There case against veganism read here

Here is just 1 small piece I read:


Vegan diets

Vegan diets are deficient, but it may take years before any deficiency symptoms are noticeable. For adults. Children can be damaged much more quickly.
In the beginning, a raw vegan diet can be very cleansing, especially if you came off a SAD diet. If you are a raw vegan and love it, then you can e.g. continue until you begin to feel some of the deficiency symptoms listed here. Or just add a tiny amount of eggs & dairy (raw and organic is best). Added fish gives a good health boost. A raw vegan diet with a few added animal products is an adequate (but not optimal) diet. How much? Eat a minimum of 2% of your diet as animal foods, preferably every day for maximum effect.
Vegans who have not replenished their stores of animal fats and proteins have often slowly gotten into trouble, sometimes first showing as bad moods and depression, sometimes as dry scalp & hair, sometimes loose teeth & receding gum-line. Serious lack of B12 has caused brain damage, pain and paralysis, so be careful.
(Supplements are a must if you are a true vegan, e.g. vitamin B12, D and omega-3. But of course, NH is not in favor of supplements - they can never mimick the real thing. A truly adequate diet is better.)


Ken

[luckitri]

Under the "Need to More About Raw" section here there is good information about B12.

I think that people put their grains out - not to sprout them - but to dry them and ensure no mold prior to storage.