Looking for an Answer

[saltamontes]

A friend asked me: ''If Raw Food extend life expectancy why humans nowadays are living longer than ever before?''

...and I didn't know what to asnwer him.

[BeingK8]

Do you have to answer him? Not saying this to be snarky or anything, but is it really your job to convert or convince? Just be a raw foodie and have fun. Love your friend for who he is and leave it at that.:throwhearts:

[LaniB]

Perhaps refer them to this NY Times article which says that obesity (caused by the SAD diet), threatens to reduce the life expectancy of today's kids by as much as 5 years:

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9F01E3D7133CF934A25750C0A9639C8B 63

[kaleboy]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Li_Ching-Yuen

[Mrs. Papaya]

It's a silly, limited question. Obviously, there have been major medical advancements over time that have contributed to longer life expectancies. Plus, the people who are living to old ages now were probably raised on organic foods and also weren't part of such a sedentary culture that sat around all day playing video games and watching TV. I don't think anyone can argue that we are in a health crisis right now with obesity and sedentary lifestyles.

I don't eat raw because I think it will extend my life expectancy. I do it to keep my body as healthy as possible and, yes, hopefully prevent disease -- meaning the disease that I probably wouldn't *naturally* get, but would get from eating all this sugar and sitting around all day.

This person is just trying to put you on the defensive. And using a very, very weak argument to do so.

[BeingK8]

I'm with Mrs. P. I was just coming here to say the bit about those who are living longer starting out under much different conditions. The quality of their food during the first few decades of their lives is considerably different than what it was for those born within the last 30 and 40 years. (And certainly much different for those who are even younger).

And here's another thought...
We are all mirrors to one another and we have experiences that reflect where we are with things.

Perhaps this is really just about you doubting yourself and it manifests in your friend challenging your choices.

Where are you insecure or unsure about raw food living? How can you be a better support to yourself and feel more confident in the choices you make for you?
:heart:

[saltamontes]

I agree with all of you... the best is to stop trying to explain.

[appifanie]

It's a silly, limited question. Obviously, there have been major medical advancements over time that have contributed to longer life expectancies. Plus, the people who are living to old ages now were probably raised on organic foods and also weren't part of such a sedentary culture that sat around all day playing video games and watching TV. I don't think anyone can argue that we are in a health crisis right now with obesity and sedentary lifestyles.

I don't eat raw because I think it will extend my life expectancy. I do it to keep my body as healthy as possible and, yes, hopefully prevent disease -- meaning the disease that I probably wouldn't *naturally* get, but would get from eating all this sugar and sitting around all day.

This person is just trying to put you on the defensive. And using a very, very weak argument to do so.

totally.


I agree with all of you... the best is to stop trying to explain.

yes. those who are interested will be open to hearing, those who aren't will likely only frustrate you.

(i'm not 100% raw but 100% vegan for 6 years, so i understand this overall dilemma: )

[saltamontes]

I'm with Mrs. P. I was just coming here to say the bit about those who are living longer starting out under much different conditions. The quality of their food during the first few decades of their lives is considerably different than what it was for those born within the last 30 and 40 years. (And certainly much different for those who are even younger).

And here's another thought...
We are all mirrors to one another and we have experiences that reflect where we are with things.

Perhaps this is really just about you doubting yourself and it manifests in your friend challenging your choices.

Where are you insecure or unsure about raw food living? How can you be a better support to yourself and feel more confident in the choices you make for you?
:heart:

No not at all. I've never had doubts about my decision. How could I? I feel better than ever. I love the way my body heals itself after trying everything else before that. But I do need to defend myself constantly. The way people look at me when I tell them what my diet is :) They tell me: you have to eat everything, you are going to be sick, you are too skinny, what about your proteins, you are going to finish with anemia,... I am alone in this journey but I promise you till now I've never had any doubts. On the contrary. I try to explain everyone it is worth trying.

[RawMark]

Historic life expectancies are almost always incorrect. In fact, many scientists still have the wrong idea about it, because of some early misunderstandings and bad science. In any case, it's impossible to compare apples with apples. In relatively recent history life expectancies were shorter mostly due to poor hygiene, sanitation, and nutrition. People died of diseases like cholera, that don't really trouble us anymore, because we now understand that having crap in our water is a bad idea (unchlorinated crap, anyway; and crap in our meat is apparently OK). But go back a few thousand years and I think you'll find a different picture. I'm certainly no historian, but the only writings that I personally know of from that time that record age is what is found in the Bible, and that says that people could live for hundreds of years.

And quality of life has really dipped since around the 1960s. If you took an average sampling of, say, 100 people from the 1920s and compared them to an average sampling of 100 people from today I absolutely guarantee you'd find fitter and happier people from the 1920s. I don't know the ages of people here, but when I was a kid almost no one had allergies, glasses, asthma, or diabetes, even among the adults I knew. And I'm in my 30s.

[Arky]

...quality of life has really dipped since around the 1960s. If you took an average sampling of, say, 100 people from the 1920s and compared them to an average sampling of 100 people from today I absolutely guarantee you'd find fitter and happier people from the 1920s. I don't know the ages of people here, but when I was a kid almost no one had allergies, glasses, asthma, or diabetes, even among the adults I knew. And I'm in my 30s.


Yep, that's my sentiment on the issue, too - plenty of people fail to recognise the difference between really living and merely existing.








Having said that, I don't necessarily concur with the premise, in the original post, that Raw Food necessarily extends life expectancy, in and of itself. Sure, it may contribute, to varying degrees, in any given persons lifetime, and in varying proportions of a potentially-broader diet. Plenty of people live very long (healthy) lives without being 100% Raw, and particularly not being 100% vegan. I'm only saying this to be objective about things, not in any way to throw any cats among pigeons. It's a big human population and those few people that live notably long lives get there through a variety of different dietary, exercise, meditatory etc. paths.

So, in answer to your friend, I'd briefly say:

1) it is vital to recognise that there is a difference between 'existing' with surgery and symptomatic relief provided by pharmaceutical drugs and isolates, versus really living a healthy, postive, proactive, and generally-'high-quality' life. Statistics tend to gloss over this critical distinction, particularly when one brings into consideration the political, socio-economic, and ideological motives behind the statistical gathering and/or analyses that makes it into, or is indeed intentionally propogated within, the public domain / public consciousness. On the flip-side, do bear in mind that raw-veganism is an ideology, too, so point 2, below, is something to at least be mindful of when discussing this topic from the standpoint of a raw-foods enthusiast to a non-raw-foods member of the general public.

2) the premise that Raw Foods, per se, engender long life is not necessarily wholly accurate, and certainly not in all examples of long life.

3) it takes a combination of different things to lead to a long healthy life, including genetics, lifestyle, environmental exposure to toxins etc. etc. - Diet is but a small (albeit significant) part.



Another thread you might find interesting, may be found in the dusty depths of the forum archives:

http://www.rawfoodtalk.com/showthread.php?t=10689

[levamssg]

I know it seems necessary to defend your position ... but a better response might be to say
"thank you for caring so much about me, I really appreciate it! [ a genuine hug works well here] I'm doing fine, and liking this for now. But if I decide to change my diet, I'll check in with you for suggestions then".

and let it go - change the topic, ask what is happening that is fun and wonderful in their life.

Many times people really don't want to know the details of what you are doing, they just want to tell you what They are doing (which is much better and smarter than what you are doing of course) ... so trying to convince them about your raw diet is pointless.

[modernmonkey]

Diets drastically changed after WW2. And my parent's generation (in their 60s, born after the war) are in and out of hospital and on various medications. If it wasn't for the advancement in medicine they would be dying off now.

Also, I wouldn't put it past the food and medical industries to be in cahoots together. It's a successful relationship.

[blue_soda025]

Hm.. If I was asked that, I would just say that I care more about feeling better everyday than I do a longer lifespan. If you ask most people, they would prefer a shorter life, where they feel great everyday, than one where they live a long time but feel awful daily. That's just me though. I personally believe that lifespan is irrelevant to living a good life. As long as I feel good everyday and want to live, then the rest will work itself out.

[kaleboy]

many things contribute but mainly it is modern health care delaying what would otherwise be shorter lifespans...

[mcster]

A friend asked me: ''If Raw Food extend life expectancy why humans nowadays are living longer than ever before?''

...and I didn't know what to asnwer him.

Is it about how long you live or the quality of life you live? Because the vitality of the typical westerner over 60 lives dips south very quickly and they start facing health issues and disease. After you make this point, get him to watch the following videos and asking to explain to you how it is that these people look and act 20+ years younger than their age and manage to abstain from disease and the drugs that treat them:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WfSLnMAylxY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jcvq63B2bOY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BvsGXuyYgv8&feature=related

[Psychalone]

A friend asked me: ''If Raw Food extend life expectancy why humans nowadays are living longer than ever before?''

...and I didn't know what to asnwer him.

I just answered this in another thread.
http://rawfoodtalk.com/showthread.php?t=64481

Please whenever confronted with people spouting non-sense, ask for the scientific literature. It's up to the one making the claim to back up that claim with evidence, otherwise it's all useless here-say. If they want to have an EDUCATED debate then they have to have more than just rumors and unbacked claims. Otherwise we could get away with things like this :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UAzU9IqcBuU

o.O

[changeisgood]

I ask them in return, after all conversations involve two or more people sharing. No need to get defensive, so we discuss their diet and that it seems like they are eating too much sugar, fats, etc and they look plump, It usually startles them. And they either share openly, get defensive, or shy away from topic. If they get defensive - I ask them why, since they feel their eating habits are okay. I may then tell them all the healings I have received.

It's just that raw is new. Same way my generation was treated for anything we did new - and I'm from the era that starting the reshaping of how people think (60s and 70s).

For myself, I'm not thinking of the long haul - I'm just grateful for how well I feel now.

There is also genetics in place. As a retired nurse I've seen young people who lived healthy lifestyles die young and very old people 90s and even into 100s who ate what I would call poorly, live long. Their diet may have been filled with bad diets and no exercise, but they have lots of close family and friends and love and caring thru out their life. And many have/had a strong belief in God.