Oh, so that's why they call it detox

[willowriver]

I've been high raw on again, off again for years. Mostly off again. :( But otherwise I eat pretty healthy, and I've been vegan for many years, which has at least kept my weight where I want it.
In the past year or so, my acne has gotten worse than usual. Bad enough that I'm really, really starting to mind. (I'm almost 24! This is supposed to be gone by now! I'm surrounded by people eating KFC double-downs with clear skin, and the health nut vegan is breaking out! Unfair.) Anyhow, I'm constantly saying how I know it's because my diet has been slipping, and I know if I went raw, my acne would go away. I know because I've done months high raw in the past, and my eyes and skin were the subject of daily compliments of complete strangers. But my bf got fed up with hearing about this suspicious panacea, and kind of challenged me to prove it, which I was more than happy to do. I decided to do 2 weeks 100% raw, which I've never done before.

Ladies and gents, I made it about 3 days. I am now in complete awe of you guys. First day was awesome. I felt awesome. Second day ditto. I ate when I was hungry. Stopped when I wasn't. Ate simply. Mostly fruits and veggies. On the third day the cravings came out - big time. I was forced at work to push back my lunch time, and my blood sugar crashed in a major way. I just started craving anything and everything that was cooked, and hence, calorie-dense. I felt fine when I ate though. AND by the third day I could tell that my skin was soooooooooo much better! It worked! Another few days and there wouldn't be a trace of a red mark anywhere on my face! And I was getting serious compliments on my big bright eyes again. That's all it took! 3 days! I was impressed and happy. On the fourth day, my body went insane with cravings. I felt like I was eating and eating and still hungry. I didn't want to see another piece of fruit for the rest of my life, and all of my savory "un-cooked" foods made me nauseated. The cravings came with physical symptoms that literally felt like an alcohol hangover. Headache, bad mood, nausea, sore muscles, etc. I couldn't take it. I ate a giant falafel and hummus platter at a Middle Eastern restaurant. The next day, I broke out badly.

So obviously this diet is awesome. But I had a hard time keeping up the calories. I plugged them into an online calculator, in desperation on the fourth day, and found to my dismay that I was nowhere near eating a reasonable amount of calories, even though I couldn't eat another bite. I don't want/need to lose a lot of weight. Also, holy crap detox! I didn't really totally believe in it until now. It doesn't make a lot of sense in my head. But it really didn't feel like the flu or anything - it felt like a hangover, alcohol withdrawal. And it went away immediately after eating cooked food. I'm wondering how much is mental and how much is physical, but it doesn't really matter, because the symptoms are real.

Enough of my rambling (sorry!). I really want to know how to get enough calories without eating mostly fats (which seems to sap my energy like cooked does), and what you guys do about intense cravings and detox. I work 8-5, so it's not like I can just check out for the day and pamper myself like I'd like to when I feel like this.

Thanks! And I bow to all of you who went through this and came out the other side as happy rawbies!

[Stella Green]

Dear Willowriver,

I so totally and completely empathize with you. I turned to raw because of my skin too, and I go through raw detox all the time because I keep going back to cooked. :rolleyes: My main problem that I have to get over is going out with friends and being such a spectacle, especially because before I discovered raw, I was known as a "cheesetarian." So I feel a little bit of a hypocrite for giving you advice, when I am going through the same thing. But anyway, keeping that in mind, here is my two sense:

it sounds as if you need a little more variety in your diet. You said that after the third day, you couldn't even look at another piece of fruit and that you were craving all kinds of savory uncooked foods, "savory" being the key word here. I think the best plan of attack is to arm yourself with raw cookbooks and recipes that are savory and uncooked. I'm not quite sure I know where you're at in the raw foodie knowledge, but you can make lots of delicious goodness with cashew love, avocados, oh and have you tried raw falafel? Whenever you are craving cooked stuff, try to figure out what you're craving--fat? something creamy? something warming? and match it with the world of raw. Larabars are a great, quick snack bar when you are in a pinch.

Okay, now I have to take my own advice and find some delish raw cheesy dishes...

[Cottonball McFluffy]

I went on raw partly for my skin as well. The other reason was my weight. But dang, I'm over 30 and I don't think I've ever had a clear skin, even after going on the Pill for it. Well, not a day until raw. It's still taking time for my skin to heal from old scras, but it's so smooth, it makes me giddy.
Now, I did notice that there are certain things that make me break out and certain things that, while not raw, I can have occasionally without it messing up my skin. Regular store candies are out, obviously. Meats as well. As sad as I am about it, it seems that I can't really process any kind of animal products well including cheese (*sigh*), so when and if I get cravings for cooked items, I just try to stick with vegan stuff to keep the skin in line.
Also, nuts seem to irritate in larger amounts, so I try to keep to avocados and other types of vegan fats besides them.

Calories? I don't count them. Eat when hungry, try to learn to eat loads more than what I'm used to in one go, monitor myself so that I'll eat in time. The feeling of hunger like I'm used to goes away, so I need to remind myself to eat every few hours otherwise I'll get cranky and lethargic. Smoothies. Green especially for cravings, but all smoothies are good. Loads od energy packed in small space.
Hope that help. :)

[RawHeaven]

Congrats willowriver. You may want to consider doing a cleanse of your choice. A cleansed colon for example is directly related to overall skin health.

[sport]

It is easy to say "ignore the calories" but you are more likely to succeed and to stick with raw if you get enough calories.
In fact I will say that you are destined to fail if you do not get enough.
How many calories do you require per day. I need 1900 and I get them. It is not too hard once you get it into your head.

[willowriver]

Thanks for all the tips and support!

Stella, thanks, it's good to know someone else is in the same boat. I've tried savory raw recipes, but almost every one has just tasted horrible. I'm a pretty good cook, and I can make anything non-vegan be vegan and amazing, but I can't make a non-sweet raw dish that isn't horrible (well, with one exception of flax tortillas and nut taco "meat"). And I've got 3 books, including Alissa's. I've been reading for a long time about raw, and I think I've heard most of the common foods/techniques, but I can't seem to get it to turn out in the kitchen.

Cottonball (awesome name, btw), I hear that. The Pill did not one darned thing for me, except apparently (I had to do the detective work myself because every Western doctor I've been to is pretty darned useless) give me a severe B vitamin deficiency and an associated severe chronic pain disorder (that going off the Pill immediately solved, thank goodness). I'm so happy to hear that raw healed you! That's interesting what you say about nuts. I had similar suspicions. Avocados are definitely my fat of choice. I'll definitely up the smoothie intake. I can just throw one in a coffee thermos and nobody will get on my case about it.

RawHeaven, I don't know much about cleanses. I'll look that up!

Sport, fitday.com says I should be burning a little over 2,000 calories just with my daily work life, with an additional 300-500 when I work out (3-5 days a week). These sound like overestimates to me, but I was having a hard time hitting 1000. I just couldn't eat enough food. I think my stomach wasn't used to the bulk. Maybe I'll try and do more smoothies, and buy a ton of bananas.

[willowriver]

In good news, it only took about a day to go from, "I never want to see another piece of fruit again!" to craving raw food again, so there's still hope for me. My body wants back on the raw wagon.
But let me tell you, that disgusting raw "stir fry" I made is going in the trash. :P I'm apparently not at all a fan of Bragg's.

[EscapeArtist]

Wow this is exactly what keeps happening to me. I can't get past day 4!! The cravings just call to me too strongly.
I guess i'm not as strong willed as I thought.
I think you and I are gradual people. Maybe we should try eliminating the addicting foods one by one before we go raw, and then adding in a percentage of raw food.
I would say to make sure that you steer clear of bread and milk before attempting raw. Personally i'm gluten intolerant and lactose intolerant, (which makes the detox even stronger) but both of these products have morphine-like opiates in them, which makes the detox so much worse and a lot more like real drug detox!

I've decided that raw is too much pressure on me alone, so I'm holding off on 100% raw until I go to a raw ecovillage. (It's cheaper than Tree of Life or some raw resort). I wish you the best, don't give up!

[willowriver]

Oooh, bread, really? Now THAT'S some very useful info. I knew that about milk, but as a vegan, I haven't had dairy in about 3 years. However, when I cave, I tend to go straight for bread and bread-type-things, to make myself feel "normal". So what is it, the wheat? Is this true for sprouted wheat, like Ezekiel bread? This seems to explain a lot.

[Dimond]

Start eating much more high calorie fruit like bananas, apples, mango. Fruit should make up a huge part of your diet, otherwise you'll end up consuming too many fats. There's very little calories in veggies. Usually you don't have to worry about overconsumption of fats while adjusting to being raw, but it never hurts to form good habits now.

[Cottonball McFluffy]

Oooh, bread, really? Now THAT'S some very useful info. I knew that about milk, but as a vegan, I haven't had dairy in about 3 years. However, when I cave, I tend to go straight for bread and bread-type-things, to make myself feel "normal". So what is it, the wheat? Is this true for sprouted wheat, like Ezekiel bread? This seems to explain a lot.
Wheat is majorly addictive and it probably doesn't help that wheat and wheat-based stuff is added to just about everything produced in western countries. I considered it lucky that I was diagnosed with Coeliac disease so that wheat is absolutely off my diet, but even knowing how majorly bad it's for me, it still took me several years to eliminate it from my diet completely. I don't know which is worse; trying to quit smoking or quit wheat. It just so ingraned in our colletive minds as something everybody does that I still have relatives who refuse to believe I just can't have any of it.

On the upside; once you're past the wheat, it's smooth sailing. :D

[kjduf]

When I started out raw I had a green smoothie for breakfast and ate normal lunch and dinner (sad). Then I added lunch (salad) and finally added dinner raw. I found that I felt great all day until dinner then I felt really drained and tired. That took about 2-3 weeks. Now I am almost 100% raw and LOVING IT!!

Don't beat yourself up the first step to change is just acknowledging that you want to change. It will come, think of it as a journey.

[RawHeaven]

RawHeaven, I don't know much about cleanses. I'll look that up!



Raw foods for the most part will naturally cleanse the entire body, but some of us need a jump start if you will. Yes, check it out if it feels like something you might consider. I completed a few master cleanses, not for everyone as some of the recipe ingredients are cooked. Juice fasting just might be the alternative for you. There is a fasting section on this forum. When I did cleanse my liver, colon and kidneys my skin was glowing in combination with eating living foods thereafter. I personally feel that cleansing the system is a good idea once or twice a year anyway due to environmental and other toxins. I always feel refreshed and energized afterwards & my cleaner system only motivates me to continue on a primarily raw foods diet.

I hope you find what works for you. Keep the faith and don't give up.

Cheers.

[EscapeArtist]

Wheat is majorly addictive and it probably doesn't help that wheat and wheat-based stuff is added to just about everything produced in western countries. I considered it lucky that I was diagnosed with Coeliac disease so that wheat is absolutely off my diet, but even knowing how majorly bad it's for me, it still took me several years to eliminate it from my diet completely. I don't know which is worse; trying to quit smoking or quit wheat. It just so ingraned in our colletive minds as something everybody does that I still have relatives who refuse to believe I just can't have any of it.

On the upside; once you're past the wheat, it's smooth sailing. :D

I am either gluten intolerant, gluten sensitive or have Celiacs, (i haven't been tested) and am currently trying to "quit" wheat and milk.. I think it's been a week and my god it is harder than I expected! It really is like an opiate withdrawal. It's something I have to get past before I go raw, the cravings are too intense otherwise. Good to hear it's smooth sailing afterwards though! How long did the horrible cravings last for you?

[Cottonball McFluffy]

I am either gluten intolerant, gluten sensitive or have Celiacs, (i haven't been tested) and am currently trying to "quit" wheat and milk.. I think it's been a week and my god it is harder than I expected! It really is like an opiate withdrawal. It's something I have to get past before I go raw, the cravings are too intense otherwise. Good to hear it's smooth sailing afterwards though! How long did the horrible cravings last for you?
Gosh, it's been years now so it's hard to remember exactly.... a year, maybe? It takes a long while, I'm not going to lie. But the worst are the first few months. You've probably already done this, but I'd suggest getting rid of all the stuff in your house that's made of wheat or has any additives in it that are even remotely suspicious. Starches and syrups often have wheat in them, glucose-frustose syrup (and glucose syrup) is also often made out of wheat, so all of those are out. items that say "made in a factory/productionline that handles wheat" are also out just because even if it might be tempting, you're still gambling with your health.
And I know it's not raw, but when transitioning from "normal" diet to gluten free one, I did a lot of baking with gluten free flour. If you do, make sure you use a mixture that doesn't have wheat startch added to it. Pick one that's a pure potato/rice/buckwheat/corn mixture. It doesn't addict the same way as the more prosessed gluten-free mixtures.

Oh, and soy sauce has wheat in it. I was tempted to get mirin sauce yesterday, but it was pretty pricey.... but something that you might want to look into for flavouring.
Getting rid of gluten has been one of the best experiences in my life. It pretty much automatically removed all junk food possibilities, most candies (which I was overindulging in) and did away with a depression I'd been suffering from for several years.. if not longer. It's hard to tell how depressed I might have been as a young child. Best gift ever. :D

[willowriver]

Oh my gosh, thanks so much for that suggestion, Cottonball!
I spent a long while today looking up symptoms of mild gluten intolerance and gluten addictions. It is sooooooooo familiar. I consider myself healthy, but I go through long bouts of upset stomach every few months, and have since I was a child. And the opiate withdrawal symptoms described when going off gluten ... it's exactly what I experienced! Plus, my genetic make-up is English/Irish/Scottish, which apparently puts me at super high risk for gluten intolerance.

So I've got a new game plan. I'll go high raw, increasing my percentage gradually as I learn how to eat properly, as suggested by others here. I will also be 100% gluten-free, for at least a couple of weeks, to see if this is the culprit. If I'm still having massive cravings, and I'm eating gluten-free cooked food, then it's gluten withdrawal. Ditto if I magically feel awesome after 2 weeks.

I'll also look into juice-feasting, as suggested, especially if my cravings get too ridiculous. I've heard it's a good way to quit cravings and such quickly.

Thanks so much you guys! You may have changed my life!