A conversation I just had... *angry*

[Amii]

Please have a look at the conversation below and tell me I'm not crazy :(
Also I'M NOT KNOCKING RAW FOOD. I just need to hear thoughts on this, PLEASE :(


Me: You know how Diabetes is meant to be incurable?

Friend: It's treatable but not curable.

Me: *Links him to Simply Raw* CURABLE, there you are!

Friend: If there was a cure it would be all over the news. My best friend has diabetes.

Me: Blah blah blah, mainstream medicine.

Friend: What?

Me: I have watched the entire film. Watch the experiment before you make claims like that.

Friend: Don't believe everything you read, Amy.

Me: ... it's a FILM. Watch the film and then you'll see how they're all cured at the end!! Also, I know someone who copied this experiment and cured their type 2 (This is a stretch of truth. I just remembered seeing a post on here from someone whose diabetes cured through raw).

Friend: *Links me to diabetes.co.uk* Read that there. "Cures for diabetes remain elusive"

Me: Watch the damn film, seriously. Skeptics like you do my head in.

Friend: Fools like YOU do MY head in, who can blindly believe it!

Me: You know what, not enough people have faith in holistic medicine. The medical doctors here had me on about four different medications for my eye problems for THREE years and all that happened was my eyes got worse. Then I went to Turkey, they were horrified at all the drugs I was on, took them off me and instead told me to drink a glass of OJ each day for vitamin C. And I got better. Don't believe everything YOU read :P

Friend: Oh my god, I am a scientist ffs (He's not. He just finished high school, like me. He has a medical textbook, that's all). I know chemicals really well. It's just voodoo bullshit.

Me: So then, please explain to me why no medicine cured me, but vitamin C did?

Friend: Because you don't give things enough time. A case in point is the Implant. Two weeks and it was out (Re: Contraceptive implant, which after I read the opinions here on Raw Food Talk, I had it removed :) ) , so you don't give things enough time.

Me: Three years isn't enough time??

Friend: I don't know about eye problems but I'm not going to talk about voodoo crap. You may as well convince me to join a religion on the basis that a monkey told you to believe it.

Me: Even though the proof that it works is right there in that film?? And also how is eating healthy 'voodoo'??

Friend: These crappy people said they'd cure my best friend, he said he was 100% cured, next thing I knew I was at his funeral.

Me: Well then he wasn't cured was he, he just thought he was? But these people ACTUALLY got cured.

Friend: It's all bullshit nonsense.

Me: I still think you should watch the movie.

Friend: No.



I swear, I feel like crying. What the hell is this?? Please, I really want to hear your thoughts on this subject!

[lovenlife]

I leave the people alone and let them decide what they want to believe.

If they ask me I help them lovingly.

I never use force or come across to them as the ultimate expert.

The movie (from my understanding) didnt cure diabetes. It is a lessening (blaancing of the blood sugar)of it and the person must keep within the diet guidelines to stay that way? But I might be mistaken.hee hee

Our upset is only if we expect people to do a certain thing or feel the way we feel. When we offer and let it go, then we are at peace.

[joya]

I'm sorry, it sounds like your friend is still mourning the loss of his (her?) friend. And has blamed "voodoo" medicine for the friends death, rather than the actual disease itself. Grief and anger are powerful emotions, so while I know you feel like you are trying to help your friend open up their mind to medical and lifestyle "alternatives"... it may be difficult to get through to him (her?) right now.

The best thing you can do is love your friend and silently lead by example of living a healthy (raw) life.

I know it might feel frustrating. But as you know, people come to their own realizations in their own time. Or not.

[lovenlife]

awesome thoughts joya.

In other words, your friends comments were NOT ABOUT YOU at all.

I would say, drop all the thoughts of how you want it to go and simply LOVE that person. Really every human is seeking to be loved and appreciated.

[lodestar]

all such good advice. xox

[jadelois]

I agree with all the above, I'm very much in two minds coming from a science background myself. Diabetes and even some forms of cancer I think can be reversed from this lifestyle but there's always diseases that will only respond to mainstream medicine, I avoid painkillers except in extremes but when it comes to certain vaccines I would always take them, it's a personal choice and all that but I find myself sat central

[Mad Mex]

Dear Amii,

unfortunately, there are people in this world which are allergic against intelligence. To discuss with them is a waste of time, so avoid it!
My father is the same, he likes his SAD lifestyle, lucky him, he is pretty healthy with 66. I love him, I respect his way of living, but for Gods sake, I would never discuss with him about my lifestyle. He knows about it, sometimes he mentions that I do miss things, I just answer no with slight and simple informations, nothing to attack, THAT'S it.

A fight with a beloved one is not worth to proselytise this person. You cannot force someone into his luck, even if it has severe consequences.

Wish you all the best and saludos,

Marcel :cool:

[Revvell]

"Leave others to their otherness and take care of yourself."

You made yourself angry. Anger creates an acidic environment. Why do that to yourself?

[rawviveyourself]

Me: Watch the damn film, seriously. Skeptics like you do my head in.

This line seems to be the turning point in the conversation to me. It might have been slipping south until this point, but this statement seems to open the emotional floodgates.

A little background about me: I began studying a healing modality in the mid-90s. It is remarkable. Phenomenal. Sometimes even instantaneous. It's scientific. Not woo-woo. (Well, perhaps woo-woo considering a person's perspective.)

I have been bursting at the seams for 15+ years wanting this to become a mainstream way of healing. Wanting people to understand it. Use it.

Over this length of time I've had to realize it will appear to people when they are ready to see it. Until that time, no amount of excitement on my behalf is going to change things.

Yes, Amii, it can be challenging at first to realize you hold some really wonderful, valuable information that can change lives in a positive way and people are not listening. But it is their choice. Love them anyway. You have no idea what their karma is, as we are only really looking at snapshots at any given moment.

And if need be, love these people from a distance until you can learn to respond in a compassionate and non-emotive way that is truly healthy for YOU.

mwah! {{hugs}}

[CathyA.]

It's tough. My favorite advice from this thread is--"Let others to their otherness." Even though you may want to....it is not your job to change people, just love them.
Hugs and love to you!!!

[Aleesha Sattva]

***i had diabetes and don't anymore... raw food rawks!***

[Green_Woman]

You made yourself angry. Anger creates an acidic environment. Why do that to yourself?

That's kind of what I was thinking... it sounds as if you talked yourself into a tizzy than anything.

I am famous for doing that. :D

[JennaHoneyBear]

Ya, it's tough talking to a brick wall like that. it can get so frustrating.

but you know....I used to be a brick wall like that. I say now "how can people not even listen to me, how can they be so ignorant and naive.." well, I used to be that person. I used to say how stupid vegans and vegetarians are and make fun of them, you-need-meat-to-survive type stuff :rolleyes: but my eyes were opened when I, MYSELF, made the decision to watch Meet Your Meat, and it changed my life forever.
you can drag the horse to the video link, but you can't make him watch it. only himself can make him watch it. at least you planted some seeds! :)

food, I suppose, has become more like politics or religion. you can't talk to other people about your views without them getting offended. it could be your best friend, but the second your beliefs cross with theirs, it can get ugly

[lovenlife]

food, I suppose, has become more like politics or religion. you can't talk to other people about your views without them getting offended. it could be your best friend, but the second your beliefs cross with theirs, it can get ugly

There is alot to be said for how one presents a message. One presented with LOVE and without EGO or FORCE or CONTROL creates a space for the other to listen.

If the listener doesnt feel honored and appreciated for their position, they are least likely to listen to yours.



I agree with Aleesha RAW FOOD RAWKS! Let those who will hear, hear and those who will not hear, not hear.

[somelikeitraw]

When does the apple fall from the tree? When IT is ready.

I too have pointed friends with type 2 diabetes to that film. None of them watched it. I didn't pressure, just pointed them towards it. It is very sad to love people and know you have something that could make their lives so much better and they won't look/listen. It really seems to work by just being a living example. Those friends haven't gone raw, although one has gone mostly veg. The big example for me is that my 14 YO daughter is now eating much more raw food in her diet! This happened over time and by her seeing my example. In the beginning I was all over my family to do this with me and was met with much resistance. After a year, during most of which I left them alone to their sad ways, they are slowly coming round!

There is a quote from Richard Bach and I don't remember it exactly - "Argue for your limitations and sure enough their yours" (or "and you get to keep them"). While this is exactly what your (and my) friend is doing, in way, you are too. See your friend's positive qualities and focus on those. Take good care of you and let your joy shine so others can see it and wonder if maybe you do have something worth looking at.

Gosh! Sorry! I usually don't get up on soap boxes much anymore. Stepping down now. ((((hugs)))) to you!

[rawviveyourself]

Amii.....how are you doing today?:)

[D'vorah]

Here's what I think.

Your friend's BEST friend died.

You told your friend that diabetes is curable.

If your friend accepts what you're saying is true, he has to grapple with the fact that his friend died needlessly. He could have been saved, but he wasn't.

That's a huge blow, a lot to take in and process.

Your friend is responding out of great pain.

Deborah

[somelikeitraw]

Here's what I think.

Your friend's BEST friend died.

You told your friend that diabetes is curable.

If your friend accepts what you're saying is true, he has to grapple with the fact that his friend died needlessly. He could have been saved, but he wasn't.

That's a huge blow, a lot to take in and process.

Your friend is responding out of great pain.

Deborah

This makes sense and I'm glad to look at this from another view. Thanks Deborah!

[Amii]

I just want to point out that if any of you think what I did was selfish, I had never heard of this friend before. If I knew one of his friends had died from diabetes I doubt I'd have brought this up.

The main reason I told my friend about Simply Raw is because he is quite arrogant in that he insists he knows better than the doctors, yet he also insists that any kind of alternative medicine is bs. So I wanted to hear his take on the raw foods lifestyle. Thanks for your responses.

[Revvell]

So I wanted to hear his take on the raw foods lifestyle.

From what you wrote, it doesn't sound at all as though you wanted to hear his take. It reads as though you want HIM to hear YOUR take. If not, then you wouldn't have gotten angry. HE wasn't listening to you.

You're welcome. :)

[Mary Kay]

Amii,

It's so easy for me to be judgmental at the way you said it...LOL, but when you said:

Me: Watch the damn film, seriously. Skeptics like you do my head in.

You said it in such a negative way, that he would automatically want to turn away.

Maybe: "or how about JUST the trailer? --it's only seven minutes long."

It's easy for me "criticising you" after the fact...believe me, I understand how in the heat of the moment, you say things like this.

I would go back to him and apologize and tell him about the trailer. Ask him in a very nice way to view it. And reiterate, the "really, I have lots of internet buddies who used to have diabetes, and they have no reason to lie."

I wouldn't want to leave it at the way you two left it and would in fact, try again and be absolutely humble about it.

Hugs,

Mary Kay

[Amii]

Hi Revvell and Mary Kay,

I should also tell you that I did cut down the conversation a lot to put it on here.. between the whole "Don't believe everything you read" and the "Watch the damn film seriously" there was a whole rant, with him insisting that the video was a virus (Me: "It's not a virus, I just uploaded it myself." Him: "You can't even use the proper word, you're so stupid. You mean you DOWNLOADED it, and it is a virus." Me: "..No, I put it there myself, so I UPLOADED it, and no it doesn't have a virus since I put it there myself!"), and also some stuff in between with me encouraging him to give it a chance. My fault, I probably should have left that stuff in so that I didn't seem to have a huge mood swing in there all of a sudden :P but I didn't want to bore the pants off of you guys! x

[Mary Kay]

Amii,

I totally understand. I still think if you can talk to him, I'd try again...LOL, even though from the way you describe it, he's a TOTAL skeptic.

Would also be nice to leave things on a nicer note...even if you can't get him to believe you.

Hugs,

Mary Kay