How few calories is too few??

[plucked]

I've ben digging around, but can't find info on what the general consensus is on a daily calorie intake for a raw foodist. Just a quick survey if you dont mind:

How many calories do you eat in an average day?

I know alot of folks don't think it's important, its the quality, not the quantity. I tend to believe that aswell, but as I watch my daily intake, Im very suprised how little it is, and im afraid my body is in "starvation mode", hence I will not lose more fat-weight, or have a hard time of it.

Thanks for your time. :)

[sport]

Well I for one have no idea. I did not count calories before I went raw and I do not intend to now. I checked my weight and reduced my intake for a few days if I went over my required weight. I dont need to do that anymore

[swiss_miss]

Hi there! you should really try to stay above 1200 calories a day. If you go below that you will go into starvation mode for sure and your metabolism will slow down and you will store fat! How many calories you need a day also depends on how tall you are, how much you weigh and how physically active you are. You can figure out your calorie needs at this website. Hope that helps! :)

http://www.24hourfitness.com/html/fitness/fit_calc/daily/

[plucked]

I checked out that website. it says i need 1600 plus calories a day. And thats for a very light activity level. thats very disappointing. WHat the haeck could i eat in a day to get up to that level?! I dont like my greens that much! :eek:

[Rawkinlocs]

Plucked, just eat raw and eat when hungry and/or eat many small meals throughout the day. Its totally your decision rather you do or don't, but to make your raw experience more pleasant and less stressful, try not to get too caught up into the calorie count because it's really not necessary, contrary to popular belief. If you want to read further discussions we've had on this issue, I can pull them up for you - just say the word!

[Rawkinlocs]

Per your request, here ya go!...

http://www.rawfoodtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4617&highlight=calories
http://www.rawfoodtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3167&highlight=calories
http://www.rawfoodtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2851&highlight=calories

This is just a few but should give you plenty to ponder on! ;)

[plucked]

hmm..it does give me something to ponder. I see im not the only one that has been concrned about too few calories.

I incorporate our heritage into how i view my/our health. Did we eat an aprox. 2,000 calorie diet in our distant, pre-agriculture past?

Our ancestors weren't eating tortillas, coffee, milkshakes. Ok, those are obvious examples, so I've eliminated them. I also try and walk each day, as that was a mainstay of our excercise in the past.

But perhaps they did eat more then, due to all that excercise? Or, dare I say it, they ate calorie-rich meat?

Just my thoughts. Anyone else interested in this from an anthropological angle?

[swiss_miss]

Hi again! ok this is the bottom line, If you want to lose weight you will need to eat at least 1350 calories a day(or else the metabolism will slow down) yes it is harder to get your calories with raw food but you can eat things like nuts, raisins, and avocados...these foods have plenty of calories and you wont need to stuff your face the whole day if u eat them. If you are ok with your metabolism slowing down a bit and are not concerend with losing weight then dont count your calories, but if weight loss is your goal u do need to keep track. Good luck :)

[Rawkinlocs]

If you are ok with your metabolism slowing down a bit and are not concerend with losing weight then dont count your calories, but if weight loss is your goal u do need to keep track

With all due respect Swiss_miss, while the whole calorie theory probably has some truths to it if you want to get into the technicalities of it all, there are many who have had weight loss as a goal, did not count calories and yet they still lost the weight - almost effortlessly.

I'm only addressing the fact that you made it seem as though the only way to lose weight is to COUNT the calories. Perhaps these people got IN the "necessary" amount of calories, but they didn't necessarily count them...that's all I'm saying. Maybe those who are eating raw and not seeing results may want to investigate checking their caloric intake for a while to see if they're eating enough calories, etc. But my main point is that not counting calories is not necessarily conducive to a lack of weight loss.

But I digress as to not beat a dead horse because as you may have seen from the links I provided, this is an on-going debate (the calorie thing). Just wanted to mention that people have lost and do lose weight on a raw "diet" without counting calories.

[RawTruth]

So that Rawkinlocs is not standing all alone here, I'll join in this discussion. For the more experienced members, I do know that this has been brought up many times already here and is discussed in Alissa's book, but, since these are newer members asking the questions, I'm going to answer it again.

When we eat raw, one of the things we can discard along with the toxins in the processed and cooked foods is the belief that we have to count calories, fats, carbs, vitamins, and minerals. This is a fear-based mentality that we've absorbed and incorporated into our consciousness as truth when, in fact, it is grounded and formed from the fact that most non-raw foods are severely lacking in the nourishment our bodies need. When we eat those "foods", our bodies do not get what they need, so we become imbalanced in every way down to the cellular level. Thus, in order to try to make up for this, the many industries that have sprung up around and because of this unnatural way of eating have devised systems to measure and control the types of foods we eat.

I know that many of you reading this absolutely believe that calories (after all, it's just a simple unit of measure, right - said with a sigh) form the basis of what we eat and that we must balance the amount we eat with the amount we expend. And all the charts and experts have taught us this very well. But, I challenge you to suspend this belief system for a while. Give it a month ... or 3 months ... or 6 months. Stop counting calories. Eat what you want of fresh, raw vegetables, fruits, seeds, and nuts. If you're hungry, eat. If you're not, don't. You won't die.

And, I'm fairly certain (based on my experience, that of my raw friends, what Alissa and other raw food coaches have seen among hundreds of people) that you will be healthier than you've ever been. Along the way, you will likely lose weight. Some welcome this; others are dismayed. But, eventually, your body will hit its true weight.

The best thing about eating all raw & living foods is freedom from fear and worry.

You needn't weigh, measure, compute or apply any of the artificial constructs that have been devised by the meat, dairy, agricultural lobbying to create the food pyramid (yep, that's how it came about) or from the medical establishment (which has built its models based on sickness not wellness). Simply eat. Eat simply after a while, but, at the beginning for sure, just eat. Listen to your body. Rejoice when your body detoxifies. Release the hold that this culture's obsession with food has on all of us. This is the way of simplicity and ease.

If I sound like a preacher, you can forgive me ... or you can celebrate.

* * *

[Revvell]

*points up to RT* What she said. :)

Revvell

[Jo-anne]

I also back what has just been said about "no need to calorie count" when on raw.

Joanne

[swiss_miss]

If a person is concerend with their metabolism slowing down, they do need to keep their daily calorie count above a certain number. Its simple science. Of course its not improtant to count calories when eating raw food, because eventually your body weight will stabalize itself, however, if a person is trying to lose weight and burn excess calories, eating too little calories will slow down the metabolism, resulting in slower weight loss.

[Revvell]

Even then, I didn't concern myself with calories. I just added more meals to rev up the metabolism. Was I eating more calories? *shrugs* I dunno. Just ate smaller more often. I have never in my life "counted calories" or concerned myself with keeping them above or below a certain number. Of course, that's just me. ;)




If a person is concerend with their metabolism slowing down, they do need to keep their daily calorie count above a certain number. Its simple science. Of course its not improtant to count calories when eating raw food, because eventually your body weight will stabalize itself, however, if a person is trying to lose weight and burn excess calories, eating too little calories will slow down the metabolism, resulting in slower weight loss.

[RawTruth]

Its simple science.Which is based on cooked & processed foods.

Back to the original post, though -- this may sound simplistic, plucked, but, if you don't think you're eating enough, just eat more. As I mentioned (quite locaquaciously!), you needn't count calories (and you won't find many raw foodists who do).

If you're used to eating more (cooked) food than you're eating raw now, maybe that's where you're getting the idea that you're not eating much -- in comparison. It's pretty common to not eat as much since your body is actually utilizing everything you're eating instead of being able to use only a little of the cooked food ... and therefore, you get hungry again sooner with it.

However ... this advice is using the assumption that you have been eating all raw for a short time, since you haven't provided any of your background here. Maybe, if you want more feedback, you can describe what you typically eat and how long you've been eating this way.

[rawpriestess]

Okay, I'm in.

I don't believe that counting calories will help anyone lose weight.

I have counted calories and NOT lost weight, when I went on raw, I didn't pay any attention to calories and lost tons of weight.

So, just to support our board, and those on it, that have posted I am in agreement that eating raw, is eating the healthy and natural way, and our ancestors did not count calories, and neither do any animals, and neither will I.

If you choose to, so be it.

[swiss_miss]

So let me get this straight. Are you actually saying that if you eat less than what your body needs to function properly your metabolism wont slow down? Wow. I dont even know what to say to that. And no, it is not just science that applies to cooked and processed foods, it has to do with how the body reacts when it gets to few calories. To those people who ate raw and lost weight without making sure they didnt drop BELOW a certain number of calories; good for you. Consider the fact that perhaps it is not the same for everyone.

[Rawkinlocs]

Consider the fact that perhaps it is not the same for everyone.

ehhhhhXACTly! There are people who "needed" to count and keep track to lose and there are those who do/did not. On this site (and perhaps in the raw food "movement" period), I'd feel quite conifident in saying that those who did NOT count calories and lost weight might outweight those who did count!

Todd, Alissa, Sweetlips, Yani, Rawpriestess, Bethany...all of you non-calorie-counting-"losers" (WEIGHT losers) holla...check in!

As Revvell said once in a thread, if you're really concerned just eat small meals throughout the day.

One last thought...I think that mainly the whole calorie issue is an issue for those who view (consciously or even subconsciously) eating raw as a diet.

So, it all boils down to what raw means to YOU. If you view it as a diet and mainly as a means to lose weight then in your own mind, you will be bound to all the restrictions, reservations, rules, sciences, and other things that go along with dieting.

[plucked]

here's what i ate today, fitday says its 1232 calories -im trying to cram some more in. if it wasn't for the protein powder in the first smoothie it would be down another 100 cals. I had quit it, but im concerned still about the amount of protein I dont get, and of course the calorie thing.


11am breaky: smoothie with 1 cup spinach, 1 cup strawberries, 1 scoop protein powder, 1 banana, water.

1pm snack: cherry larabar

3pm snack: 1/2 oz seeds, 1/2 oz nuts, handful raisins

5pm dinner: smoothie with 1 cup spinach, 1 large banana, 1/2 cup blackberreis, water. 1 carrot

8pm (at work) snack: apple larabar

11pm snack: 1/2 oz nuts, 1/2 oz seeds, handful of raisins. 1 carrot.


I understand this is to some a "dead horse", along with the protein debate. For me it is very alive, so thank you for your thoughts, everyone! It helps me in the long run figure out what is best for me. :)

As for any other info needed in figuring out what I need nutritionally, I am female, 28, 5'3".

[pizda]

THe whole calories theory is a crap. Calories are measured by burning something. In German concentration camps prisoners were given daily 1700 calories. The erzatz bread, which was made partially from wood and empty soup. The quality of food not calories is important.
Galina Shatalova and her followers are eating 600-900 calories per day and show great results. Shatalova herself is 89 (!!!) years young. Still giving lectures, running tai-chi classes every day and hiking.
So all these new gurus has to prove to me that they are right by longevity and in what shape they will be.
Roy Walfors was another proponent of the law caloris living. He died last year at the age of 80 from Lou Gerrick desease.

[Sweet lips]

I am in - Swiss Miss, I suffer from a double whammy (aren't you excited that you are receiving all this attention :rolleyes: ) I have no thyroid gland, which means aside from the thyroid hormone (another story), I take, my body does not have the normal facility to burn any calories for weight loss. Are we clear here. I couldn't lose weight at all because my metobolism is about nil. Documentation is out there!

Simply following the raw diet, without counting anything, eating my food 100% raw, I have not only managed to lose weight, but I am almost at 30 pounds weight loss -EFFORTLESSLY

What science is that? Typically my nurtionist would prescribe all types of things for me to eat and on some ocassions, she gave me a 1000 calories diet and I exercised as well, but weight loss just wasn't happening, however, her last comment and that of her supervisor was "just keep doing what you are doing", because of raw, I am far healthier than I have ever been, although according to conventional medicine and all - I don't eat enough, and eat way too much fat, with the avocado's and nuts that I eat, not enough protein, and where am I getting my calcium, I also eat mostly salads, cause that is what I desire so I do not get in a lot of calories in my consumption of food- all in all, for a person who just completed her third challenge with cancer, I am 100% better today than I was eating as perscribed, counting calories and just doing what the establishment suggested.

It is hard to let go of thought processes and pattern that have been indoctrinated in us from birth. It is like the bible to me, stuff don't make sense, but it is real and I believe it because there is no way it can be disapproved - my results stand, are you willing to challenge those? ;)

[Sara81]

I agree 100% with RawT and RawK. I think the counting calorie theory applies to a cooked food diet since the body has difficulty getting all it's major and minor nutrients/minerals from the cooked food that is ingested. When someone is eating raw, your body tells you what it needs and when it is hungry. There is such an abundance of enzymes, minerals, nutrients that the body is rarely missing anything (unless a person doesn't vary the food he/she eats).

This is my 16th day raw and i have lost 10 pounds without even making an effort (other than staying raw). I do not count calories and i barely eat fats AND i haven't even started to exercise yet. I know for a fact that i am not eating 1200 calories just by doing the math in my head now. Fruits and veggies don't have very many calories. Another thing is i eat a little something every few hours, so i don't think my metabolism is slowing down at all since it always has to work. And if someone is exercising on top of that, there is no way the metabolism will slow down! Everyone knows that exercise, especially weight training, increases metabolism.

One more thing, when someone eats raw for a while, the body cleanses the digestive system thus making it more effective at digestion. This increases metabolism rather than decreasing it... no matter the amount of calories ingested.

[Carlene]

When I first started raw, I too worried about calories. Sure that in versus out was crucial to weight loss. Alissa came on line, said it wasn't so, of course being the smartest fat person in the world I didn't believe her. But now...

I don't count calories. I used to worry I wasn't eating enough, blamed lack of energy on it, etc. Now I doubt I eat 1000 cal a day and exercise my heart out. Except for occasional, very occasional, days that I'm tired, my energy levels grow daily. The weight is coming off at a steady pace. I am the healthiest I have been in 20 years. I have no intention of eating tons of food to satisfy science, because it wasn't my body they did their research on.

I have eaten this few calories and exercised this hard before on other eating plans. All that ever happened was I gained weight. Raw is different, and I owe Alissa a big appology.

[solarliving]

Sarah 81,

You are right on the money! A clean body does utilize nutrients better.

[swiss_miss]

Ok first of all, when I first posted on this thread, I was addressing the FEW people who have trouble losing weight on raw because for most people the weight just comes right off and as I have said before, it is not the same for everyone. I do what works for me, and making sure I eat enough does work for me. I was offering my advice to another person because I felt that person could benefit from my advice. If you are trying to lose weight and you dont eat enough, the weight loss will probably be slower, you will still lose weight but probably not as much in the long run as you would have lost if you had been eating more. I really didnt realize that these comments would be so terribly offensive. To all those people telling me "oh, thats crap!" Im telling you its not crap because it works for me so naturally I thought I would give my advice and try to help. And WOW! I was bombarded with everyone telling me how wrong I am!! haha you guys really need to relax and chill out a bit rather than trying to decide whats "right" and "wrong" Different things work for different people. I was just stating what works for me. Terribly sorry if I hurt anyones feelings with my outrageous comments :p

[Rawkinlocs]

Swiss_miss,

If you would re-read your first couple of posts, you'll see that you didn't come from a perspective of, "This is what worked for ME...perhaps it'll work for you"...no, you came from a standpoint of, "This is the way it is and if you want to lose weight, then you HAVE to count calories".

Like this one for example (with special attention on the bolded area):


Hi again! ok this is the bottom line, If you want to lose weight you will need to eat at least 1350 calories a day(or else the metabolism will slow down) yes it is harder to get your calories with raw food but you can eat things like nuts, raisins, and avocados...these foods have plenty of calories and you wont need to stuff your face the whole day if u eat them. If you are ok with your metabolism slowing down a bit and are not concerend with losing weight then dont count your calories, but if weight loss is your goal u do need to keep track. Good luck:)

That bolded part just doesn't ring true for everyone but you made it seem as though that's the end-all-be-all to weight loss success!

That is why you were bombarded with all of the responses you received because as you stated, everyone is different and these people are telling you that they lost weight, not too slowly either, and did not count calories. Simple as that. No one got offended by your comments that I can tell. You stated your opinion, we stated ours...no biggie.

I can only speak for myself when I say I am very relaxed and chilled! LOL!

But again, we've been down this calorie counting road before many times and there are just too many people here and again, within the raw community period, who did not have to do it your way and got excellent, timely weightloss results.

[swiss_miss]

Well maybe some people got excellent results without making sure they ate enough. Thats great. Im offering advice to the people who had a harder time with it. You seem to think that not keeping track of what you eat while trying to lose weight works for everyone. It dosent. All I meant to say is that if your having a hard time losing weight on raw, it would probably help to keep track and make sure your eating enough so that your body dosent go into starvation mode because that can happen with this way of eating. Especially if your just starting out and arent too familiar with raw food yet.

[Revvell]

Ahm chillin', yes indeed ahm chillin', for you and me ahm chillin' ~ as the air conditioner comes on. :D

[Revvell]

swiss_miss,

Most people here, especially IF they follow the advice of the people who have "been there, done that" and especially IF they are coming from a SAD, will tend to eat enough because they are told to eat whatever/whenever they wish. Most will be making LOTS of "gourmet" recipes. The ones who are telling you they've not "counted calories" or "watched their calories" (yeah, as they go directly into their lil moufs) are mostly speaking from experience. We KNOW how raw works and that it does "work" IF people eat whenever they are hungry and as often as they wish ~ until their systems acclimate to the higher energies, nutrients, fiber, enzymes, life, etc. they will be receiving from their new food program.

Thing is, IF something internal needs to be healed, occassionally people will find that they will maintain their weight until that issue has been handled. Nature does work it's magic.

:cool:

[swiss_miss]

All I did was give a bit of advice regarding my own experiences, but I guess its fun to gang up on one person. Why couldnt you just let me have my opinion and leave it at that? what good does it do to tell me Im wrong? I was only trying to help and got slammed for it. Nice.

[Rawkinlocs]

Okay, well I thank everyone for their input on the calorie issue and it looks like we'll have to just agree to disagree.

Swiss_miss, I understand what you're saying about some people who aren't experiencing the weight loss as they wanted to might consider investigating their caloric intake...point well taken and received. Many people actually do share your view on calories (though it wasn't evident in this thread) but if you view past discussions on the issue, you'll see that. Again, others were just stating their own opinions and personal experiences just as you did. Hopefully this won't affect other messages because I'm sure you have a lot to contribute to the board. But the whole calorie debate does tend to stir up various feelings and opinions but it's nothing personal.

I do hope to see you remain here and involved in other topics of discussion related to the raw lifestyle.

I just don't want people to think that if they don't count calories that they won't lose any weight or that their weight loss will be hindered or slowed down. It might be the case for some, but definitely not for all.

I believe that in the midst of all of this dialogue that the initial question in the original post has been answered and so I will now close this thread and leave it for the archives for anyone who wants to read it later on.


Peace!