SAD addiction?

[Rachiel]

Hey guys just a few quick q's...

I hear people say that SAD food is accictive is there any basis for this thought?

I am wondering why anyone would be "addicted" to it. I know it is mormal to become addicted to things which are detrimental to your health smoking, alcohol etc... but I wonder what is that makes it addictive or if this is just an excuse? or because most of us have been raised on cooked diets?

[RawKnitster]

I don't have any facts for you on that, but I can tell you how it is for me. I consider cooked food to be addictive because it is extremely detrimental to my health and well-being. Because after being raw long enough to get it out of my system I no longer crave it. Because if I take a single bite of cooked food I will be back at it again. Been there, done that, too many times. Like an alcoholic thinking they can have just one drink.

[spicyfull]

I don't think its addictive, as you said, we've been raised on a cooked diet and it can become the norm.

[hilarya_m]

I don't think all cooked food is addictive. I think chemically processed, GMO, preservative full food is addictive because it is ENGINEERED to be so "appealing" and we are programmed to ignore our bodies messages and fall into a cycle of dis-ease precisely from food. "They sell us the disease then they sell us the cure".

However, this food has all sorts of feel good triggers, releases seratonin, simple carbohydrates make us feel good, fats (we are taught to eat bad fats and don't know much about good fats) make food taste better and make us feel happy and satiated. So, yes we become addicted to the 'easy' ways to feel good.

I also think it is psychological. SAD food triggers memories and associations for us which are positive, closely to how scent does: sharing meals, friends and family and the like. From the anthropologic perspective, our culture specifically encourages feeding your woes with food and/or excess of some kind. For heavier people or those who have been heavy, feeding your feelings is even more prominent and those associations are even stronger, so I absolutely feel it can be an addiction in that way.

But, healthy cooked foods I don't think are addictive in the way SAD is. I find I can eat some on a monthly basis and go back to raw no problem. I have less energy and maybe feel heavier than I do when raw but not BAD or addicted. Steamed fish or vegan foods don't make me feel bad and don't trigger all the SAD things mentioned above or the desire to dive into a vat of ice cream.

[EZ rider]

Addiction defined: Compulsive physiological and psychological need for a habit forming substance.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/addiction

[Dimond]

Certain ingredients just trigger you wanting more of it such as salt & sugar.

Mainly it's all just conditioning as most of what we've learned is. When we take control of ourselves, we can accomplish anything. The longer one eats raw and continues eliminating more from that diet until you're eating a very simple raw diet, the less that should be an issue. Of course if you are constantly around SAD food and advertising, it can make it difficult. But as long as you realize it's not real & that you feel better eating raw, you should eventually get over it.

[Revvell]

From the work that I do and in my own experience, food can be highly addicting.

There are a few reasons as some have already stated. One is, the ingredients put into foods such as msg, sugar, and other chemicals that manufacturers use to make their products appealing as Hilarya said.

Another is, many people have used food as a cheap way to sedate themselves and squoosh their feelings. As one person said in a book I'm reading "It's hard to digest your feelings and food at the same time". To give that up and actually feel ~ well, that's why many don't stay on raw or, any other food program other than what they've become use to without assistance. They never learned to handle their emotions. Food is cheaper than alcohol or street drugs and many don't realize how addicting their food is until they change their food program.

Food is used in so many ways other than as nourishment. It's used to entertain, for social reasons, to sedate ourselves, as comfort, as reward and more. We bring all our "stuff" up from childhood and food/habits from then continue on into our adulthood, often unbeknownst to us and the cycle goes on until we realize what, when, where, why and how we eat and break the addictions and habits.

Revvell

[anniez]

SAD food triggers memories and associations for us which are positive, closely to how scent does: sharing meals, friends and family and the like.

I totally agree! I don't know anyone who is raw, and it is very hard for me to be "social," since so many events center around food. I want to attend all the dinner parties, but I don't want to eat all the cooked food. Food just isn't the center of my world any more. Potlucks are easier, because I can take a raw dish, and most people don't even realize it is raw. The holidays last year were particularly difficult, but that was my first year on raw. I am feeling so much better now in my second year, that I don't think the holidays will be such a challenge. I don't eat SAD at all any more, but I will eat cooked veggies at parties; I don't, however, eat animal flesh or grains. And those SAD foods are called "comfort foods" for a reason.

Annie

[snoops]

Hmm let me see. If I keep doing something that makes me feel good in the present but makes me feel like crap later, but I still keep doing it, is it an addiction. Oh yeah.

I am absolutely addicted to grains and dairy. Cows put an addictive substance in their milk for the calf's to keep coming back for more. Concentrate that in cheese and mmmm, so addictive (for me). Grains, as someone said previously raise serotonin levels and in people with depressive tenancies like me it is like a drug.

Took me 5 days of not eating any of either to not have BAD cravings for both.

[Veganforlife]

I don't think its addictive, as you said, we've been raised on a cooked diet and it can become the norm.

I disagree. It is EXTREMELY addictive. It's been proven. The sugar alone in all the foods is addictive! The CRAP (additives, etc.) they put in is addictive.

The fact you are eating empty nothings and gotta eat more and more and more until feeling full - THAT is addictive.

Aren't behaviors addictive characteristics?

[Veganforlife]

Hmm let me see. If I keep doing something that makes me feel good in the present but makes me feel like crap later, but I still keep doing it, is it an addiction. Oh yeah.

I am absolutely addicted to grains and dairy. Cows put an addictive substance in their milk for the calf's to keep coming back for more. Concentrate that in cheese and mmmm, so addictive (for me). Grains, as someone said previously raise serotonin levels and in people with depressive tenancies like me it is like a drug.

Took me 5 days of not eating any of either to not have BAD cravings for both.

HUMANS put crap in all the foods to make folks come back for more...

You figure? It's big money!

[Thick]

Perhaps some people are more sensitive to it than others. I can say from my own experience..that if you think it is not addictive..try quitting it for a week and see how you feel.

Obviously some people do not have the food issues that I do, though, so I'm willing to entertain that there might be an allergy component. Or perhaps exposure to additives over time can make you increasingly more sensitive.

It's a lot like alchohol I think. I am not tempted to drink every day. I do not have to watch the clock to wait for noon. I do not fantasize about vacations where I can drink all day. Think about all the issues, behaviors, and causes for alchoholism--and I have that with food. Some people don't, I know--just as I am not an alchoholic or drug addict and never ever would be--but I do have this problem. And raw food does cure it.

[Seedy]

I don't know that cooked food per se is addictive, but plenty of SAD foods are. There is a very interesting book by Dr. Neal Barnard called "Breaking the Food Seduction" that goes into the various addictive chemicals/opiates in cooked meats, cheeses, chocolate, etc. Another good book is 'The Pleasure Trap' by Douglas Lisle. Recommended reading both.
Seedy

[Suz58]

Both dairy and wheat cause a release of opiate like substances. So yes they are very addictive.

[rawrawks]

Addictive bigtime.

[NaiveJeanette]

obvously you've never cried while eating because you didn't want to eat it, but you were eating it anyway because you want it so bad and you dont understand why you want it so bad, and you know you'll regret it so much, but you just can't stop....:(

cooked food addiction is real and it's taken me almost 5 years now to work through my addictions to get them under control. :)

cooked food sets off the same signals in our brain as do cigs, alcohol, drugs, etc....

[rawmiss]

Here is an article about addictive foods:


Why We Eat Junk Foods and Avoid the Good Foods

Wheat and Dairy both have glue-like proteins which are very addictive. Wheat has gluten, which is what helps to make bread spongy, and dairy has casein, which is what makes cheese stringy. These proteins digest into opioid peptides. Gluten digests into gluteomorphin and dairy digests into casomorphin. “Behold the power of cheese” its called casomorphin.

In our brain these peptides mimic the effects of morphine and we get an endorphin-like “high”. Peptides are so similar to drugs that if wheat and dairy are very suddenly removed from our diet, we can get withdrawal reactions similar to those of a drug addict (like shaking).

People who have trouble digesting wheat and dairy can accumulate these peptides instead - leading to peptide poisoning. This is particularly often reported in people with ADHD, autism, schizophrenia and depression. (Dairy is also very mucus forming and is avoided by professional singers and it should be avoided when our lungs are congested or asthmatic.)

Meat has uric acid which has 3 oxypurines - compare this to caffeine which has only 2 oxypurines. If it didn’t have oxypurines we probably wouldn’t want to eat it. (This uric acid can crystallize and form in needle-like fashion around the joints, causing the pain of arthritis.)

Sugar - The addictiveness of refined sugar is well known and since fruits have lots of sugar this sometimes give fruits a bad name. But our cells run on glucose (the type of sugar in fruit), so we do need sugars in our diet and sugar cravings are based on our cells’ actual needs for glucose.
The problem is with the concentrated processed sugar not with the sugar in the whole fruits. Processed sugar starts off as sugar cane or sugar beets and the white powder left after processing represents only 10% of the sugar cane and 17% of the sugar beet (measured by weight). Over 80% of the plant is lost in processing, and that 80% includes all of the fiber and dozens of vitamins and minerals. The only way to make sugar from fruits as bad as processed sugar is to refine fruit sugar until it become a white powder, then fruit sugar might be a health problem.

When foods are addictive they tend to take over our diet because then we need to take “hits” of the same addictive foods all day long, for example we might eat the following in a day:

• BREAKFAST - Cereal made of wheat (gluteomorphin) and refined sugar with milk (casomorphin)
• COFFEE BREAK - Morphins create a cloudy or foggy brain effect so, to get anything done, we need to wake ourselves up with a jolt of caffeine and refined sugar during our coffee break.
• LUNCH- Sandwich with wheat (gluteomorphin), cheese (casomorphin) and meat (oxypurines) and a sugary drink.
• AFTERNOON SUGAR BREAK -This craving is so common that it used to be institutionalized as an afternoon tea.
• DINNER- Pizza or pasta with wheat (gluteomorphin), cheese (casomorphin) and meat (oxypurines).

We tend to eat the same types of food at every meal all day long. We’ll change them up and make them look and taste differently from meal to meal but they still have the same major addictive ingredients. What happens when we overload our body with the same foods is that our body starts to see these foods as foreign substances that need to be eliminated by antibodies. As explained in The False Fat Diet by Elson M. Haas, these antibodies add water weight (up to 10-15 pounds) that makes us look and feel bloated.

[Revvell]

Then add all the social/emotional factors of fun with pizza; breakfast with the family; Thanksgiving with relatives; breakfast in bed, blah, blah, blah. THAT's why it's so hard to eliminate the cravings and habits. They become held in the cellular memory.


Here is an article about addictive foods:


Why We Eat Junk Foods and Avoid the Good Foods

Wheat and Dairy both have glue-like proteins which are very addictive. Wheat has gluten, which is what helps to make bread spongy, and dairy has casein, which is what makes cheese stringy. These proteins digest into opioid peptides. Gluten digests into gluteomorphin and dairy digests into casomorphin. “Behold the power of cheese” its called casomorphin.

In our brain these peptides mimic the effects of morphine and we get an endorphin-like “high”. Peptides are so similar to drugs that if wheat and dairy are very suddenly removed from our diet, we can get withdrawal reactions similar to those of a drug addict (like shaking).

People who have trouble digesting wheat and dairy can accumulate these peptides instead - leading to peptide poisoning. This is particularly often reported in people with ADHD, autism, schizophrenia and depression. (Dairy is also very mucus forming and is avoided by professional singers and it should be avoided when our lungs are congested or asthmatic.)

Meat has uric acid which has 3 oxypurines - compare this to caffeine which has only 2 oxypurines. If it didn’t have oxypurines we probably wouldn’t want to eat it. (This uric acid can crystallize and form in needle-like fashion around the joints, causing the pain of arthritis.)

Sugar - The addictiveness of refined sugar is well known and since fruits have lots of sugar this sometimes give fruits a bad name. But our cells run on glucose (the type of sugar in fruit), so we do need sugars in our diet and sugar cravings are based on our cells’ actual needs for glucose.
The problem is with the concentrated processed sugar not with the sugar in the whole fruits. Processed sugar starts off as sugar cane or sugar beets and the white powder left after processing represents only 10% of the sugar cane and 17% of the sugar beet (measured by weight). Over 80% of the plant is lost in processing, and that 80% includes all of the fiber and dozens of vitamins and minerals. The only way to make sugar from fruits as bad as processed sugar is to refine fruit sugar until it become a white powder, then fruit sugar might be a health problem.

When foods are addictive they tend to take over our diet because then we need to take “hits” of the same addictive foods all day long, for example we might eat the following in a day:

• BREAKFAST - Cereal made of wheat (gluteomorphin) and refined sugar with milk (casomorphin)
• COFFEE BREAK - Morphins create a cloudy or foggy brain effect so, to get anything done, we need to wake ourselves up with a jolt of caffeine and refined sugar during our coffee break.
• LUNCH- Sandwich with wheat (gluteomorphin), cheese (casomorphin) and meat (oxypurines) and a sugary drink.
• AFTERNOON SUGAR BREAK -This craving is so common that it used to be institutionalized as an afternoon tea.
• DINNER- Pizza or pasta with wheat (gluteomorphin), cheese (casomorphin) and meat (oxypurines).

We tend to eat the same types of food at every meal all day long. We’ll change them up and make them look and taste differently from meal to meal but they still have the same major addictive ingredients. What happens when we overload our body with the same foods is that our body starts to see these foods as foreign substances that need to be eliminated by antibodies. As explained in The False Fat Diet by Elson M. Haas, these antibodies add water weight (up to 10-15 pounds) that makes us look and feel bloated.

[Rachiel]

If I ever crave meat it is chicken which I never ate when I was non raw. It contains triptophan which is a precursor to seretonin.

This whole thread is really interesting and has inspired me to do some work researching addiction into foods while I am still able to access scientific papers free through uni.

You peeps are awesome!!!

[qfmother]

Sugar is definitely addictive for me - I've proven it to myself many times when the cravings for sweets go away after a few days of abstaining even through very strong cravings.

Another big issue for me is emotional eating, which is why I consider myself a food addict. Obviously we are all food addicts in the respect that we must eat to survive, but my addiction is that I use food for emotional reasons rather than to satisfy my hunger. I eat when I'm angry, upset, bored, tired, happy, overwhelmed, and just about every other time. Or at least I should say I USED to be this way - because eating raw for the last (almost) 9 months has greatly helped with this and I am well on the way to permanently overcoming this addiction.

I can only speak for myself, but I can't help but observe that many other people seem to share my food addiction and it is extremely normal and accepted (even expected) in this culture. Many people can handle it, but from the amount of overweight and obese people in this country today, it is obvious to me that many people can't handle it and have a food addiction just like I do.

[Rachiel]

It is interesting to know that mice prefer sugar water to a sweetner water. It shows that in mice at least they are able to tell which provides the most energy without taste (I think it has been done after removing taste receptors too) I think that this may be part of the reason we get addicted to high energy junk... because we used to need the high energy as we didn't know when our next meal would be so would ingest sugary faty etc... It may be programmed behaviour.

[D'vorah]

I recently got on a plane to fly to another state. I had the isle seat. The occupant of the window seat arrived, I had to get up to let him in. He didn't FIT in one seat. I hoped against hope that he had had the grace to purchase two seats, since he took up a third of the middle seat. He hacked, coughed, cleared his sinuses in the most distgusting way. He was greasy and nasty. I am certain he has sleep apnea along with a host of other issues that I couldn't observe. No way his joints don't hurt, not possible, and I bet he isn't able to climb a flight of stairs.

Does anyone really DECIDE to live this way? Hey, I wanna be Jabba the Hut when I grow up. Does anyone really WANT to be like this? No, of course not. I'm sure his weight crept up on him like so many other Americans, like mine did. I'm sure that if he could keep eating his favorite SAD foods and have the weight magically disappear, he'd jump at the chance. I bet he doesn't know he has a real, viable choice. The medical industry has so pushed gastric bypass that a lot of Americans who could loose weight via raw or (sorry, have to include it) cooked low-fat vegan are being brainwashed into assuming they can't, that they're just one more victim of poor genetics and helpless beyond that. And they don't even know that they're addicts because the food industry touts stuff as "health food" that is anything but. Heck, my health food store is PACKED with unhealthy stuff. And society almost seems to applaud a "healthy" appetite, and by that I mean the ability to pack it in.

So, what do y'all think, is this guy a food addict?

I felt badly for the guy who had purchased the middle seat but only got two thirds of it, which meant he was practically leaning over into my lap. I would have felt badly for the window seat guy if I hadn't felt so imposed upon by his inconsideration for others and the nasty sounds he made. Now, from a distance, I can feel sad for him.

I know I am one (food addict) and I'm fighting as hard as I can. This afternoon I went to a huge annual craft show and the food smells there were so strong, and things that I used to believe I could eat at any time, delaying the inevitable.

And to make it worse, as I was leaving the show and walking through the parking lot, there sat someone in a car RELISHING a not-raw meal. Oye, oye, oye.

So, what I did, as I began to drive away, was to praise myself for having not purchased any popcorn, not accepted offers of samples of fresh salmon spread. And as I praised myself, a small feeling of self-pride crept in. Very small, but present, so, I fanned it's wee-tiny little flames until it grew and grew some more and I actually felt truly and really proud of myself. And then I sat in the glow of it for a while.

:-)


Deborah

[Seedy]

I recently got on a plane to fly to another state. I had the isle seat. The occupant of the window seat arrived, I had to get up to let him in. He didn't FIT in one seat. I hoped against hope that he had had the grace to purchase two seats, since he took up a third of the middle seat. He hacked, coughed, cleared his sinuses in the most distgusting way. He was greasy and nasty. I am certain he has sleep apnea along with a host of other issues that I couldn't observe. No way his joints don't hurt, not possible, and I bet he isn't able to climb a flight of stairs.

Does anyone really DECIDE to live this way? Hey, I wanna be Jabba the Hut when I grow up. Does anyone really WANT to be like this? No, of course not. I'm sure his weight crept up on him like so many other Americans, like mine did. I'm sure that if he could keep eating his favorite SAD foods and have the weight magically disappear, he'd jump at the chance. I bet he doesn't know he has a real, viable choice. The medical industry has so pushed gastric bypass that a lot of Americans who could loose weight via raw or (sorry, have to include it) cooked low-fat vegan are being brainwashed into assuming they can't, that they're just one more victim of poor genetics and helpless beyond that. And they don't even know that they're addicts because the food industry touts stuff as "health food" that is anything but. Heck, my health food store is PACKED with unhealthy stuff. And society almost seems to applaud a "healthy" appetite, and by that I mean the ability to pack it in.

So, what do y'all think, is this guy a food addict?

I felt badly for the guy who had purchased the middle seat but only got two thirds of it, which meant he was practically leaning over into my lap. I would have felt badly for the window seat guy if I hadn't felt so imposed upon by his inconsideration for others and the nasty sounds he made. Now, from a distance, I can feel sad for him.

I know I am one (food addict) and I'm fighting as hard as I can. This afternoon I went to a huge annual craft show and the food smells there were so strong, and things that I used to believe I could eat at any time, delaying the inevitable.

And to make it worse, as I was leaving the show and walking through the parking lot, there sat someone in a car RELISHING a not-raw meal. Oye, oye, oye.

So, what I did, as I began to drive away, was to praise myself for having not purchased any popcorn, not accepted offers of samples of fresh salmon spread. And as I praised myself, a small feeling of self-pride crept in. Very small, but present, so, I fanned it's wee-tiny little flames until it grew and grew some more and I actually felt truly and really proud of myself. And then I sat in the glow of it for a while.

:-)


Deborah

Your post reminded me of myself about 10 years back. I was over 300 pounds, severely asthmatic and addicted to antihistamines to try and control my allergies. When I got on a plane to fly for business, I needed to ask for a belt extender. So I understand the mortification that poor man must have felt with the other passengers giving him the stink eye. But it was that experience, more than anything else, that gave me the desire to change my life. Everyone has that Ah Ha moment. An airplane to Atlanta was mine.
Seedy

[D'vorah]

Your post reminded me of myself about 10 years back. I was over 300 pounds, severely asthmatic and addicted to antihistamines to try and control my allergies. When I got on a plane to fly for business, I needed to ask for a belt extender. So I understand the mortification that poor man must have felt with the other passengers giving him the stink eye. But it was that experience, more than anything else, that gave me the desire to change my life. Everyone has that Ah Ha moment. An airplane to Atlanta was mine.
Seedy

I hear stories like yours and I think, "hero." You faced it down.

I think the way for me to look at it, and maybe this will inspire others is this. We can be mortified at how we look, sound and smell. We can be angry at or terrified by encroaching diseases that threaten our safety. If we do these things, we treat ourselves with a degree of contempt and we violate hope.

OR - we can befriend our weight. We can embrace and value the scary diseases and even "love" them. They aren't our enemies. They are our friends, they have arrived at our point of teachable moment to tell us things, teach us things, and mentor us in the process and journey back to wellness and fitness.

D

[DopeRawAbundance]

It depends on what you consider an addiction, I'm not sure how well this syncs up to the definition of addiction but sometimes I can get caught up in eating "SAD fuds" to the point where I lose sight of my foodvalues. I look at the box and think Captain Crunch is my friend all over again.

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1329/1322466333_bc037b8266.jpg

Get a life cap'n.

[katchmoleen]

Cap'n Crunch was my FAVE when I was a kid (lo these many years ago!) even though He cut my mouth to shreds inside cause the corners of the pieces were so sharp. Now THAT is addiction.

[commoncents]

Because if I take a single bite of cooked food I will be back at it again. Been there, done that, too many times. Like an alcoholic thinking they can have just one drink.[/QUOTE]

Ditto, Ditto, Ditto!