Are These Things Not Raw!!!!!

[kailaniece]

I found this on http://www.purelyraw.com/deadfoodlist.htm

It basically says that many products can SAY they are raw but are not in fact truly raw. . . this is very unsettleing as I just spent lots of money on some of these things... I've been eating raw cashews like a fiend (well compared to when I was not raw) Any help deciphering whether this is true or not by some of the veterans would be helpful. Some things are obvious, but things like Bragg and other Alissa staples better be raw! Here is a synopsis by "sarabethxvx" (to give her credit) of it cause I can't copy it from the original site:

Agave: There is controversy over "raw" agave nectar is truly raw. According to the dead list on goneraw.com it is NOT raw. According to the madhava website their agave labeled as raw has not been heated over 113 degrees... eat at your own risk.
Almonds: All almonds grown in america now have to undergo pasteurization, so even if they are labeled as raw they ARE NOT raw. You must seek out imported unpasteurized almonds online or in health food stores. You can also buy directly from some california almond growers and get unpasteurized almonds.
Bottled juices: any bottled store bought juice may have been pasteurized, a process requiring heating to kill bacteria, and are not raw. Fresh juice can be made at home or obtained from a juice bar you trust.
Brazil Nuts: If they are shelled they are most likely NOT RAW, unless you bought them from a living foods website. They are heated in the shelling process.
Braggs liquid aminos delicious but not a raw food
Cashews: There is a toxic substance between the shell and the fruit and they are often boilled prior to shelling. Not raw even if labeled raw unless purchased from a living foods company.
Cacao: can reach temperatures over 120 degrees during the fermentation process. Buy from a company you trust.
Canned Coconut Milk: Not raw :( Commercially bought shredded coconut probably isn't raw either, check with the manufacturer. One way to make your own coconut milk is to blend one part shredded dried coconut with 3 parts water. Then strain well ;)
Dried Fruit: Unless you dried it yourself probably heated too high
Ezekial Bread: Even god can't make this bread raw.
Frozen Fruits and Veggies Unless you froze it yourself it may have been blanched or boiled.
Ground nuts and seeds: Any nut or seed butters or flours, including almond butter, flax meal, tahini etc... May have gone through machinery that heated it beyond acceptable temperatures.
Hijiki: Dried at high temperatures
Macadamia Nuts: Shelled nuts have been heated in the shelling process
Miso: Delicious but not raw, even unpasteurized is made from cooked grains
Maple Syrup: Sorry, not raw
Manna Bread: Sadly not raw
Nama Shoyu: Not raw
Nori (seaweed): Even Raw labeled nori may have been dried at high temperatures, check with the company you buy from
Nutritional Yeast: So delicious and nutritious, but not raw
Oats: Oats are generally steamed to kill pests even if labeled raw
Oils: Olive and other bottled oils are not usually raw. Get Unfiltered Cold Pressed oils and you are more likely to be ok. Best bet is to check with the company.
Olives:If canned, jarred or packed they're usually cooked and normally in bad oils as well.
Pecans: Shelled nuts have been heated in the shelling process
Pickles: Most have been heated in the canning process. Bubbies Pickles ARE raw.
Spices: Store bought spices cannot be counted on to be unheated during the drying/jarring process. Check with the manufacturer or dry your own.
SugarAll processed cane sugar has been boiled and dried at high temps. Even 'Raw' sugar is NOT raw and often dyed brown.
Vinegar: Most all vinegar is not raw. Apple cider vinegars may be raw. I have heard bragg brand acv is raw... not positive though.
Wild Rice: Blanched after harvest to keep pests out


I AM NOT TRYING TO PROMOTE ANYTHING OTHER THAN A VEGAN RAW DIET I PROMISE, I JUST WANT TO DISPEL WHAT IS FALSE AND EMBRACE WHAT IS TRUE SO I DON'T INADVERTANTLY FAIL BECAUSE OF MY OWN IGNORANCE. LIKE I SAID, SOME OF THIS IS ALREADY OBVIOUS FROM ALISSAS BOOK, BUT SOME IS PROBLEMATIC.

Thanks for your help fellow detectives!

K

[raven]

I think the list is correct. This is not news to most raw foodists. It's hard to know exactly what is completely raw because products may be labelled raw and still heated during processing to the point above which they would not be considered raw to raw foodists. Each person has to decide what they're comfortable including in his or her diet. Many consider miso to be a living food, although it's not technically raw. If you buy from certain companies, you can be more certain that a product is raw than if you buy it from some place like Trader Joe's, who readily admit that not everything on their shelves labelled "raw" meets the standard of never being heated about 118 degrees.

Suzy

[Eva]

Yup the list looks about right to me from what I've read in several places -- I try to avoid almost all of those things as a general rule. I am probably going to put in an order for almonds from CA soon as I am missing almonds -- but I'm not sure as I'm trying to have more local, fresh food.

Otherwise, all the other stuff is off my list for the most part. When I buy dried coconut or oats, it's only from Alissa. I've been out for awhile, but I have bought the agave that says raw from Madhava. They do also have one that does not say raw, but of course I can't be 100% sure that the one I've purchased was "really" raw even though it says it.

Cashews/macadamia nuts are a tossup for me. I haven't had them in awhile, but I felt fine having limited quantities when I had them (better with the macs from Hawaii than from the cashews, though). I do NOT feel just fine with Braggs, Nama Shoyu, nutritional yeast, or kombucha, although many raw foodists consider them to be acceptable and have no problem.

[Veganforlife]

As I enter year three of being 100% raw I have learned to choose and pick my battles. If I get an ORGANIC spice and use a teaspoon in a recipe - does that mean I'm 99% raw? - give me a break! If I use some miso in a recipe does THAT make me 99% raw? - give me another break!

I look at it this way. I am wa-aaaay healthier then I was three years ago. I am living. I was basically dying before. My body was revolting and keeping me sick and fat and very unhealthy and tired.

Life is about choices.

If I CHOOSE to use a questionable product, so be it. All I know is this has healed and cured me. I will continue to do what I do.

[WendyLouWho]

There are ways around certain items on the list labeled "not raw." I make my own pickles with cukes and veggies from my garden and don't process them in boiling water (refridgerator pickles...so fresh and yummy). Also, I buy my pecans at the farmer's markets here in the fall and those have all been painstakingly shelled by hand, no heating. I know that may not be an option for those not in a pecan tree flooded state :(

Dry your own fruit, make your coconut meat and milk, etc.

That said, I agree with VeganforLife...a little spice or shoyu is a choice and it's a darn sight healthier to chose those items than any SAD food.

I've always been a little puzzled by some of the ""all or nothing" attitudes in the raw food community. Like there is a hierarchy of raw foodists and those who chose to use maple syrup or some other non-raw flavor or spice are less than?

I do think it's good to have the knowledge on the list, though.

[Eva]

I've always been a little puzzled by some of the "all or nothing" attitudes in the raw food community. Like there is a hierarchy of raw foodists and those who chose to use maple syrup or some other non-raw flavor or spice are less than?

I do think it's good to have the knowledge on the list, though.

I could be missing something, but in my mind there's no hierarchy. I choose this or that based on how it's made me feel in the past or if it's working for me. I choose not to have NS, Bragg's, nutritional yeast and some of the other questionable stuff. I test the waters with stuff I'm not sure about and am always open to reevaluating my choices... But if I share on this forum that I don't do this or that, I'm not certainly not judging those who choose otherwise or feeling like I'm "better."

Anyways, that likely wasn't directed at me (especially since I shared that I don't know if the agave is raw and whathaveyou)... but I do often share that I don't have this or that even though some people do.

Anyhow, I thought sharing more about my perspective might be helpful. Some people DO choose to "really" go "100%" -- and will share information based on their choice. I hope no one else who is making different personal choices feels like (or feels that others have the attitude that) they are "less than"...

We're all sort of in this together here. We just want to be healthy for this reason or that -- and raw food is great for that! :)

[WendyLouWho]

I should have clarified that I don't get that attitude here at all! It's very supportive and all about health and healing here. I like the vibe. I was referring to other experiences I've had online and in person. YMMV.

[Eva]

I should have clarified that I don't get that attitude here at all! It's very supportive and all about health and healing here. I like the vibe. I was referring to other experiences I've had online and in person. YMMV.

Yay! That's good to hear. I don't know what YMMV means -- but I get your message. :) I get that feeling too. That's why I responded. I was hoping you weren't feeling like anyone was judging if you are on one side of the fence or the other...

[tanishamarshall]

The website sounds right to me. We do have to be really careful to purchase from companies we trust. But like Lucy I don't get worked up about it because I know for a fact I am better off now then I have ever been.

Maybe over time during my raw journey I'll start to refine my diet but for now I don't worry about it.

[Veganforlife]

I should have clarified that I don't get that attitude here at all! It's very supportive and all about health and healing here. I like the vibe. I was referring to other experiences I've had online and in person. YMMV.

I hear 'ya. I've had that too. Where one is almost frowned upon because one chooses to use a questionable product. Not here. I've never experienced that. To them I say "PFFFFTTTT!!!"

But, do be aware of the money-making aspect out there. As raw becomes more and more desirable - it's gonna become more and more of a money-making business.

I try to make all my own "stuff" too. That way I KNOW it's pure. But for the once in a while gotta haves - I'll make that decision which way to fly!!!

[Rawkinlocs]

I've always been of the mind that the only way to for definite SURE be a 100% UNADULTERATED raw foodist is when one gets to the point of no longer using anything that comes pre-packaged, dehydrated, etc. Why? Because no one really knows, ya know? I mean, I've had "arguments" with people on this forum in the past about the "questionable" items and my stance has always been:

Unless we are working in the company or taking a tour of the company who makes this stuff we do not know for absolute, positive certain that their products are, indeed, raw or made at "acceptable" temperatures. Even IF they "say" they are...who is to stop anyone from lying? Really...who?

We have to take them at their word pretty much, correct?

While there are some who will outright say that their products are not raw...some may not and who would be the wiser?

But I've never been a "purist" when it comes to that stuff (cashews, agave, etc.) and again, should the day ever come that I decided to be...that would be the day when I decide to eat nothing but fresh fruit and veggies...and even then, we still don't really know for sure if even THOSE items have not been steam-treated, etc. unless we grow them ourselves or get locally-grown, of course.

Yep, I agree with Lucy...pick and choose my battles!

But thanks for the list...it is nice to at least be aware...I guess...

[lavendarJ]

Good Morning-

I with lucy and docsharp and learned to relax, relate and release. I am so grateful for being in the "know" about what is best for my body. And I definitely follow a Good/Better/Best philosophy when it comes to those things that are questionable, I know that if I accept the terms of the list then it is best to do without those things, but do I still use some of the things on the list, yes and I know that for me it is better to eat some brazils if I want because I like them and they are yummy and beneficial and it's better than turning to a non raw vegan snack- I've seen a list like that before somewhere a long time ago.

WendyLouWho- I know exactly where you are coming from. This website is a very good site and Alissa's philosophy on this raw vegan journey is very simple. August 1st will be my 2nd year anniversary - I do know exactly what you are talking about though, I have ran into some die hard 100%'s who charged me with treason and wanted to brand me with a 98.6% to be worn on my chest for life and for what: drinking a hot tea with out using a thermometer to check the degree:eek: , for using agave syrup:( , for using spices that were "suspect":mad: --- Seriously, some of the raw vegans that I met during my first raw vegan year snubbed me as if I was some kind of traitor. I felt like I needed to do a public apology or something and was really anal about every little thing I put in my mouth and then eventually I figured out what is best for me, I'm like lucy "Get Real" and Rawks with picking your battles , and I add "Get Over Yourself"..

I celebrate living a raw vegan life and look forward to learning more and more about myself as this journey continues. I refuse to turn this into a diet and develop the mentality that I messed up, broke a rule,or something. I refuse to make this a diet; been on enough of those to last me a lifetime and I have always viewed diets as a temporary fix. This is my lifelong journey and I celebrate me for finallly being in the know about what is best for my body to function effectively...

Happy Happy Joy Joy Everybody

[Aleesha Sattva]

i completely agree with the list... the only thing i get concerned about - if the item i'm using is for supplemental purposes. like spirulina. i ask at the health food store and they've contacted the manufacturer to find out the heating temp of the spirulina - they find out if it's raw for me.

but other than that... i choose to use balsamic vinegar cause it makes me happy. i also choose to use frozen fruit in our smoothies etc.

on the other side of the coin... i choose to not use braggs.

it's all about choices but... it's important for lists like this to exist so people who are unaware at this point in their journey... can become aware!

[rawfoodistdavid]

Raw for me is not about being 100% and getting a gold badge. I did the transitional thing and dind't even try to go cold turkey.

While I'd been a sugar and processed food-shunning lacto-veggie for years and avid eater of wholefoods I realised my diet - stellar by SAD standards - was often far from natural and when I got hit with a pretty big health issue a year ago.

Everything's been geared towards gradually improving health. Ditching dairy was largely a good move but I know I'm often in danger of low Vitamin low as a psoriasis sufferer living in a country where the sky is gloomy most of the time. So I continued to take Cod Liver Oil supplements and still do. I'm investigating things like alfalfa as by D source but I'm in no hurry. I think Cod Liver Oil is good for people.

In other areas I have ditched lots of fermented products. I used to be stumped for dressings as every salad dressing I knew was vinegar based. I'm now learning to make great dressing with lemon, lime and orange juice.

It's hard to do the raw nut thing in the UK as finding out if nuts are truly raw seems to be difficult. However, I don't eat vast amounts of nuts anyhow and am not too interested in the ultra-gourmet raw food that sometimes seems to be not much more than a 'cashew nut sculpture with a gallon of agave'. So I'm not too alarmed.

If you piled up everything I ate in a week, by weight and volume it'd be 90-95% uncontroversial raw vegan. I'm okay with that.

[cherries]

Thanks for this list, it is very interesting, I didn't realize that brazil nuts were heated. I'll have to try sprouting all my nuts/seeds to see which ones are really raw. I think that with a lot of the nuts/seeds the raw lable is meant indicate to the consumer that they are not roasted.

Frozen fruit is raw, at least with all the ones that I looked into, also, berries are so fragile, if they were blanched they would look wilted wouldn't they?

Raisins are dried in the field, on cardboard laid out between the rows of vines:

http://www1.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview_approve/3603257/2/istockphoto_3603257-close-up-raisins-drying.jpg

[cara4art]

Count me in with several people here about not getting worked up into a lather about whether this or that ingredient is truly raw or not. Lots of the things on that list are things that aren't used in anywhere as large quantities as the produce that is the foundation of a raw food diet anyway. I mean, really, the only way to be ideally 100% raw is to ONLY eat raw fruits and veggies, period, which some people indeed do get to the stage of doing. But for a lot of us, having some of the other stuff in there is helpful in keeping us raw to begin with, and are way better off than before we went raw. It's not worth stressing out about, IMO, as it takes away from the joyful abundance in a well-rounded raw food lifestyle that includes some denser foods and treats. Compare that list to the regular c*** that's in SAD-er's refrigerators and you'll see what I mean.
For the record, from time to time I do use Braggs, cashews and nutritional yeast, as well as a little balsamic vinegar occasionally for variation. I like miso during the cooler months too, and will likely try some cacao in desserts(at such time as I pop for a food processor!). And I'm sure not going to worry if a pinch of spice is raw or not.

[annavon]

I think the key here is to use some discretion and listen to your body. If you eat one of those non-raw things and you feel bad the next day, you know you shouldn't eat it. I know for me that I have be use Braggs, nama shoyu and miso very sparingly, if at all since soy products naturally contain glutamines which is what msg is made of and I am sensitive to glutamines. This is a hard one for me because I was born in Japan and grew eating a lot of Japanese food. I was excited when I saw these things in some raw cook books and now I need to re-think this.

One thing, I am sort of relieved to hear about the cashews and macadamia nuts. Last year, I made a recipe using them and I felt sick afterward. I actually gave up on raw food after that (until recently). I now know not to use them or risk feeling icky again.

[ShantiDass]

I find it all confusing but I'm a newbie. I took a "raw prep class" and she made things with nama shoyu, Bragg's, spices, and agave, etc. I had never heard of agave and since it's a raw class, I thought it was raw until recently. I love that stuff! She also mentioned using Ezekial bread. I went to the store and looked at it and looked it up on my iPhone while in line and read on their website that it's not raw so I put it back. So, I understand your shock as I kind of feel like I've been lied to by so many raw food people/books.

I do believe everyone has to make their own choices for them but I wish the correct information was given out so that I can make my choice and not be led into believing something is raw when it isn't. I have read several "raw vegan" books and they don't mention that some of the ingredients aren't really raw and some of the recipes contain honey. I'm having the same trouble at raw restaurants when I ask if the food is vegan and they say yes. I then ask if it contains honey and they also say yes. That's not an issue for many people but it is for me as I'm a vegan for moral reasons and find bee barf disgusting. I don't eat meat and I don't eat that and it's not vegan.

I'm still struggling with finding my path on my raw food adventure and am not sure which items I will or won't use. I also feel that I can't say I'm 100% raw as I have used agave and spices, etc. I don't think anyone is really keeping track but me and I need to do what is comfortable for me. And as soon as I figure out what that is, I'll give you a call! :D

[kailaniece]

Thank you for all of your advice!!! I love the idea of not stressing out about what is raw and what isn't. I really love being healthy, and living raw is when I feel at my best. I am so inspired when I read some of the success stories here and doubly impressed when I get such meaningful advice from you all. IT really is all about choice and knowing all of the facts so that you can find the way that is most beneficial for YOU. Everyone is so different and yet the simply choice of filling your plate with beautifully nutritious fuel brings us all to a place of peace... So I'm not going to fret about the questionable items. I tend to enjoy a simple diet for the most part anyhow. Anything "quasi raw but not cooked or toasted" is bounds healthier than my old diet comprised of restaurant fare and rich and cheesy home cooking. I do appreciate you all!

With luv,

Kaila

[ViolinCyndee]

I find it all confusing but I'm a newbie. I took a "raw prep class" and she made things with nama shoyu, Bragg's, spices, and agave, etc. I had never heard of agave and since it's a raw class, I thought it was raw until recently. I love that stuff! She also mentioned using Ezekial bread. I went to the store and looked at it and looked it up on my iPhone while in line and read on their website that it's not raw so I put it back. So, I understand your shock as I kind of feel like I've been lied to by so many raw food people/books.

I do believe everyone has to make their own choices for them but I wish the correct information was given out so that I can make my choice and not be led into believing something is raw when it isn't. I have read several "raw vegan" books and they don't mention that some of the ingredients aren't really raw and some of the recipes contain honey. I'm having the same trouble at raw restaurants when I ask if the food is vegan and they say yes. I then ask if it contains honey and they also say yes. That's not an issue for many people but it is for me as I'm a vegan for moral reasons and find bee barf disgusting. I don't eat meat and I don't eat that and it's not vegan.


I totally agree with this! Eating honey is definitely not vegan.

I am very new at raw, also, and am not necessarily going to be 100% raw anyway. I will def be at least 80% raw (or more), and think that if anyone is even 50% raw and vegan, they are doing great.

I agree that one has to pick their battles. :)

[tanishamarshall]

Thank you for all of your advice!!! I love the idea of not stressing out about what is raw and what isn't. I really love being healthy, and living raw is when I feel at my best. I am so inspired when I read some of the success stories here and doubly impressed when I get such meaningful advice from you all. IT really is all about choice and knowing all of the facts so that you can find the way that is most beneficial for YOU. Everyone is so different and yet the simply choice of filling your plate with beautifully nutritious fuel brings us all to a place of peace... So I'm not going to fret about the questionable items. I tend to enjoy a simple diet for the most part anyhow. Anything "quasi raw but not cooked or toasted" is bounds healthier than my old diet comprised of restaurant fare and rich and cheesy home cooking. I do appreciate you all!

With luv,

Kaila

Glad to hear you have peace about it. I think what is most important as someone already mentioned is that we listen to our body, it will definitely tell us if something is right for us or not. I know mine does almost right away but we are all different. I believe the longer you are raw or even high raw the better you will be able to understand what works and what doesn't.

[ViolinCyndee]

Glad to hear you have peace about it. I think what is most important as someone already mentioned is that we listen to our body, it will definitely tell us if something is right for us or not. I know mine does almost right away but we are all different. I believe the longer you are raw or even high raw the better you will be able to understand what works and what doesn't.

I am really glad you included 'high raw' in that! :D That is exactly my goal for now, at least--to be high raw. I have been raw since yesterday and have had such YUMMY food! I am really excited that it's not just about salad. In fact, I didn't even have an actual salad between yesterday and today.

I DID use some of the ingredients on this list though....But am not going to worry about it.

Tonight I had soft tacos with walnut meat in a collard wrap and banana ice cream. I also just made rasp/nut breakfast bars and have Alissa's swiss cheese in the dehydrator now.

Very excited! :D