Can you feed a baby raw cow's milk???

[Arctichicken]

Hi all, I'm very new so please be nice. I was wondering if one can feed a baby raw cow's milk instead of the that processed powdered formula? That of course if a mom couldn't breastfeed for very long. If anyone knows I would love to hear about it. Thanks

[Aleesha Sattva]

i would say, No.

http://www.naturalnews.com/cartoons/cows_milk_600.jpg

Welcome!

[Revvell]

You can if you want it to be unhealthy, mucusy, and such.

Here's information you may want to peruse: http://notmilk.com/

[Raw Yogini]

I don't know very much about this issue but I've heard in necessary situations that goat's milk is closer to human breastmilk than other animal milk. Breastfeeding is the absolute best way to go, though. What is the breastfeeding issue? How old is the infant, etc? PLEASE don't use cow's milk.
Best wishes!

[Clare]

Don't do cow's milk straight, even raw. That's how babies used to get very sick and even die, before formula. Cow's milk is for cows. If breastfeeding is not possible, you can make a good formula with raw goat's milk that involves a slight dilution with additional lactose and vitamins. By about 6-9 months raw goat's milk is OK straight. By age two of course there's no need for milk. Carrot juice is good at that point, as well as nut/seed milks. There is a decent recipe for raw cow's formula out there which you can find at the Weston A. Price site. But it's a pain to make with many ingredients. SHows how "off" cow's milk is for babies. Plus, the coconut oil in it solidifies when refrigerated and each bottle needs to be warmed. I did the raw goat thing for my adopted babies and it worked beautifully. And even at $6-10/gallon, was still waaaaaaaay cheaper than dead formula.

[Revvell]

Ya knowww, this is a raw vegan site and milk/dairy is not recommended here?

[Raw Yogini]

So what is the raw vegan solution to feeding infants w/out the opportunity to breastfeed?

[Raene]

I've heard hemp milk is the best vegan option, along with coconut water/milk. I don't think any vegan options are good. I think breast is the only way...and if you can't bf, I think you should be getting milk from a mama who can donate to you.

[Revvell]

So what is the raw vegan solution to feeding infants w/out the opportunity to breastfeed?

If I remember correctly, in one of Dr. Walker's books, he recommended carrot juice. It's certainly got to be better than cow's milk.

[Mama K]

If I remember correctly, in one of Dr. Walker's books, he recommended carrot juice. It's certainly got to be better than cow's milk.

Not to cause a debate, but infants NEED breastmilk to develop properly. Carrot juice is a great thing, but babies need fats and other nutrients that are only found in breastmilk in order for their brains and bodies to grow. We are mammals... we have mammories for a reason. :p Feeding an infant a plant based diet, even soy-based formula, can be very hard on their system and is very far from ideal. Animals in the wild don't break out the juicer or blender to mix up some replacement for human milk. They just nurse their babies until they can eat "solids" in some form. :)

Of course a vegan diet after baby is ready for solid foods around 6 months + human breast milk can be very healthy! Which I'm sure was your point, but I am just scared that someone might read this and think that carrot juice is a replacement for breastmilk which could really be a problem.

If you cannot breastfeed, the second best option is to get human milk from a milk bank or another nursing woman. I have heard that the milk protien in goats milk is closer to human milk than cow's milk in that it is easier for the baby to digest. (Of course recommending that is NOT vegan and is not following the guidlines of this particular forum. Not to mention goat's milk is for baby goats and giving them all they need to be a healthy goat. So much would still need to be added to it make it passable for a baby's development.) Milk from your own species is the only way to ensure proper development. :)

The OP might have been asking because many drs still push the x amount of whole milk for toddlers. They no longer recommend ANY cow's milk for babies under a year old. Breast milk (or formula) is to be the main source of nutrition for the first year of life according to the AAP. Solids or "complimentary foods" should be introduced at 6months of age (or older) when baby shows signs that they are ready.

Hope I'm not out of line here, but as most people on here are concerned with healthy, natural living I don't think I'm saying anything too controversial. :D

[cherries]

If I remember correctly, in one of Dr. Walker's books, he recommended carrot juice. It's certainly got to be better than cow's milk.

I read on a Australian raw food forum about a baby that was taken away from his mom for a month by the social services, the mom was feeding him carrot juice and he was severely underweight. I always wondered where she got that idea.

http://www.all-creatures.org/health/breastcancer-leu.html
As far as raw cows milk, cows milk is one "food" which really does need to be cooked prior to consumtion. A high percentage of cows carry the leukemia virus which is killed by pasturization. Dairy producing regions (where dairy farmers are likely to drink the raw milk that they produce rather than buy the paturized milk from the store) have higher rates of leukemia than other parts of the country.

[Raw Yogini]

Carrot juice has no fats in it. Fats are extremely important for the development of a baby's brain and nervous system. I agree w/ Mama K. I can't see how it would be an adequate replacement.

[Revvell]

Not to cause a debate, but infants NEED breastmilk to develop properly.

Not debating that.

[Revvell]

I read on a Australian raw food forum about a baby that was taken away from his mom for a month by the social services, the mom was feeding him carrot juice and he was severely underweight. I always wondered where she got that idea.


We still don't know where she got that idea and if it was the only thing she was feeding it. Also, I didn't say it was the ONLY thing to feed a baby. Just going from my recollection. IF I had a child, which I don't, I'd be doing a lot of different fruit and vegetable juices and seed/nut mylks IF I couldn't breastfeed and had no other options... but then, the point is moot for me. :)

[Mama K]

Not debating that.

Ok, good! :D I didn't think you were really.
I was just scared someone might read this thread and think that carrot juice could be used as formula. There are some silly people out there. :rolleyes:

[cherries]

Also, I didn't say it was the ONLY thing to feed a baby. :)

You're right, some carrot juice would be awsome.!

One other thing, is to not overlook lauric acid. Lauric acid is found in human milk, and in only a few other food sources in significant quantities. The best source is coconut, in fact coconut has been added to some baby formulas to replace the lauric acid babies would otherwise get from their mom. I use coconut oil for my kids, since it's easy to use, I mix it with brewers yeast and spread it on crackers.

http://www.thaifoodandtravel.com/ingredients/cocmilk.html
"Contrary to popular myth, it does not transform into bad cholesterol to clog up arteries. In fact, cultures around the world that depend on coconut as their main source of fat have been found to be free of heart disease. The principle fatty acid in coconut milk is lauric acid, which is the same fat found in abundance in mother's milk and is known to promote normal brain development and contribute to healthy bones. It also has important anti-carcinogenic and anti-pathogenic properties and is less likely to cause weight gain than polyunsaturated oils."

[Revvell]

So, in case I'm dealing with a mother with a newborn or a bit older who can't breast-feed, cracking open a coconut and giving the child coconut milk would be a good thing?



You're right, some carrot juice would be awsome.!

One other thing, is to not overlook lauric acid. Lauric acid is found in human milk, and in only a few other food sources in significant quantities. The best source is coconut, in fact coconut has been added to some baby formulas to replace the lauric acid babies would otherwise get from their mom. I use coconut oil for my kids, since it's easy to use, I mix it with brewers yeast and spread it on crackers.

http://www.thaifoodandtravel.com/ingredients/cocmilk.html
"Contrary to popular myth, it does not transform into bad cholesterol to clog up arteries. In fact, cultures around the world that depend on coconut as their main source of fat have been found to be free of heart disease. The principle fatty acid in coconut milk is lauric acid, which is the same fat found in abundance in mother's milk and is known to promote normal brain development and contribute to healthy bones. It also has important anti-carcinogenic and anti-pathogenic properties and is less likely to cause weight gain than polyunsaturated oils."

[cherries]

That's a great idea Revell! lauric acid is hard to find in big quanitites in vegan form, except for in coconuts and palm oil (http://www.personaldietplanner.com/articles/nutrients/fatty_acids/dodecanoic_acid_lauric_acid.html). Per 100g there is 88mg in the water, 14.86g in the flesh and 44.6g in the oil. Coconut oil is amost half lauric acid!

[carolg]

My friend, brigittemars.com, raised two beautiful healthy girls, now women and moms, one being www.rainbeaumars.com without any dairy products. I'll write her and see if she replies what she did. Her other daughter is gorgeous too!

carolg

[carolg]

My friend said she gave her kids red clover blossom and alfalfa teas. (what cows eat). I made nut milks (sesame and almond after a year old.).

Just wanted to share what she did.

I wonder what Storm did with all his "kiddies?" What about Melissa, Raw Baby Alex, mom? What about Doug Graham? Can't ask Paul Nisson yes, rawlife.com, as his wife is expecting their first child. She's 12 weeks per his note he emailed people other day.

Hope this helps some of you here.

carolg

[Raw Yogini]

They probably breastfed. The issue is what to give a baby that doesn't have the opportunity to breastfeed.

The original post was asking what to give instead of breastmilk. She didn't state a specific age but my assumption from the post was that the baby was under a year. I was thinking 3 or 4 months old but it didn't say for sure.

[firefaery]

If I remember correctly, in one of Dr. Walker's books, he recommended carrot juice. It's certainly got to be better than cow's milk.

actually that would kill an infant rather rapidly. they cannot process the naturally occurring nitrates. Their kidney function would plummet. even as a supplement it is a very misinformed idea.

There is no vegan option. Please PLEASE understand that.

That said, donor milk is a great bet. Cow's milk is not. Goat's is closer but needs to be doctored into a formula. It is also VERY high in potassium. IF the baby is not going to be breastfeeding for whatever reason (though breast is essential) then you really shouldn't be going this alone. Please get help, and have someone who is trained guiding you. The internet is great to acquire info, but if you don't have the background to assess it you need someone who does. This is nothing to mess with.

Welcome! :)

[firefaery]

That's a great idea Revell! lauric acid is hard to find in big quanitites in vegan form, except for in coconuts and palm oil (http://www.personaldietplanner.com/articles/nutrients/fatty_acids/dodecanoic_acid_lauric_acid.html). Per 100g there is 88mg in the water, 14.86g in the flesh and 44.6g in the oil. Coconut oil is amost half lauric acid!

not to be nit picky here...but ya'll do understand that lauric acid is one of the THOUSANDS of components of breastmilk, right? Infants require cholesterol, DHA, EFA's, micronutrients etc which *can* be measured and potentially replicated. What about the stuff that CAN'T be measured? What about the stuff that cannot be produced in a lab? If nothing else, what about the immunoglobulins? A baby's gut is porous (as it was designed to be) and everything taken in passes into their bloodstream. The immunoglobulins are what create the immune system. Anything else (especially formula) passes freely into the bloodstream with no barrier. With breastfeeding mom is hte barrier. IF her gut is faulty then you see reactions in babies and mom needs to dietary modification. If her gut is faulty she is passing proteins that the infant isn't ready for and the baby launches an immune system defense that results in an inflammatory state.

In this case when the baby appears to be "allergic" to mom's milk, it is a sign that mom needs healing. But even as the proteins are being passes so too are the innumerable benefits of nature's most perfect food.

The gut closes around 2 years. That is when the immune system has been primarily developed. In my *opinion* it is essential to nurse at least occasionally until 2 years. Even the AAP recommends 2 years for your nursing relationship.

An infant has a very different system than adults. It is ESSENTIAL to understand this fact. Just because it's good for us doesn't mean it comes close to being good for them.

[Stina]

The most comprehensive work I've seen on this is in Sally Fallon's book Nourishing Traditions. If a woman can't breastfeed, she explores how to make a formula appropriate for a newborn. It's not vegan, but one exception I agree with.

[Revvell]

Great information here. Glad this question was asked, I answered and got lots of good feedback. Rated it a 5 star.

Now I need to go and find what Dr. Walker REALLY said and not what my memory tells me. :rolleyes:

[Rinda]

I, too, wouldn't go with cow's milk. However, I do agree with some that suggested goat's milk. Source out someone locally that can provide you with some from goats that are raised with healthy living conditions and on organic pasture, etc.

I don't know the reason why the mother can't nurse very long, but, if it has anything to do with not feeling like she has a good enough milk supply, please check into something that increases it. The herbal extract, Marshmallow, is fantastic for milk supply (from my own experience and many others). It works!

[Sternenhimmel]

It depends on the age of the baby !
If your baby is still very little and if you can't breastfeed, you can't give him a vegan alternative or raw milk !!!
The processed powder milk has been specially adapted for babies who aren't breastfed. And there is no alternative !!!

However, you can give raw milk to little children. That's ok, I mean they won't die and it is better than cooked milk. Our parents gave raw milk to me and my sisters and brothers.

But the best and healthiest solution for baby is to drink the milk from mummy. :)

[firefaery]

Powdered formula is also a dangerous alternative. You will notice that a large majority of the recalls with formula have been with the powdered version. There is a high risk of contamination....both bacterial and foreign substance. There have also been ground glass and metal shards discovered in the substance. This is why when hospitals and formula companies violate the WHO code by direct marketing they do so with the liquid version. (If you google infant formula recalls you will get an astonishing number of results.)

http://pediatrics.about.com/od/weeklyquestion/a/04_baby_formula.htm
http://209.85.215.104/search?q=cache:jw6I7Aj0Ut4J:www.naba-breastfeeding.org/images/Recalls.pdf+infant+formula+recall&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=3&gl=us

I am not an advocate of formula feeding, but if you are going to do it it is best to stick with the ready to feed version. They all carry significant risk, but the lesser of two evils is DEFINITELY the ready to feed in this case.

[Clare]

Dr. Gerson told a story about giving a "baby" (probably around 9mo) bottles of fresh carrot juice while the mother detoxed several weeks on cancer therapy. Apparently in the short term it worked wonders, however I'm sure the baby was receiving other things, probably meusli, yogurt, fruits, egg yolks, etc according to what people fed babies in Germany then...babies of course don't need any of that so young if they have good breast milk to eat.

My goat formula from birth was: 2 cups raw goat (or TJ's when we were traveling), 1 cup reverse osmosis water, 1.5 T lactose, 1/4 tsp cod liver oil, and a daily dose of liquid infant multi (must have C and folic acid). The dilution and addition of lactose mimics human milk in macronutrient ratios. Yes I know it's not breast milk but those cute goats we visited every week were at least eating greens and avoiding junk food all day which is more than most moms can say. I would take that over random human milk any day.

At six months I began some solids, including coconut cream, bananas, avocado, egg yolk. At 12 months I switched to organic soy milk (I wasn't raw yet and lost my source of raw goat milk). Now I am making almond milk since my younger is 18 months and older is almost 3. They also drink green smoothies and carrot/fruit juice most mornings.

[thinagain]

Not to cause a debate, but infants NEED breastmilk to develop properly. Carrot juice is a great thing, but babies need fats and other nutrients that are only found in breastmilk in order for their brains and bodies to grow. We are mammals... we have mammories for a reason. :p Feeding an infant a plant based diet, even soy-based formula, can be very hard on their system and is very far from ideal. Animals in the wild don't break out the juicer or blender to mix up some replacement for human milk. They just nurse their babies until they can eat "solids" in some form. :)

:D


I agree!!!!!!

[diamondscape]

When my first son was very small around 2 weeks old I became very sick and stopped nursing. We found an excellent local organic farm that delivered raw goats milk to my door once a week. It saved us really. He did amazing on it. And is still so super duper healthy. Yes breast is best but as an alternative the goatey milk is totally the next best thing. And it is somewhat easy to come by. If your a friend stopped breastfeeding esp. if they were not super informed about health issues the goat milk might not be so far fetched to grasp.

My son is now 7 and he is so strong sometimes we joke about his affinity to goats!!!!

I did go on to nurse my other two am still nursing the youngest.

When doing research on the goats milk back when... I also read that it has selenium in it which is something that really boosts immune support.

BTW we just gave it to him raw with no added features!!! He did awesome on it...

Thank you God for the GOATS!!!!

Peace

[ofthebridge]

Another thing I heard was actually mixing raw goats milk with carrot juice. Kinf of a half anf half thing. iguess I would do that if I couldn't breastfeed but I would add some type of fat like flax seed oil as you would be cutting the fat content by a half.

[fuggles]

i would say, No.

http://www.naturalnews.com/cartoons/cows_milk_600.jpg

Welcome!

However Mike Adams, natural news or newstarget as it used to be called, did promote raw cows milk.

the great thing about Naturalnews is he is open minded, sometimes he has raw eggs and sometimes he decides to go 100 per cent raw vegan and eliminate all dairy. He tries most products even though they might not be raw simply because he is open minded to new ideas.

[Ilse W.]

080903K - I absolutely DISAGREE!

As far as cows milk goes - T. Colin Campbell in The China Study made a connection between feeding babies cows milk and Type I Diabetes.

[Stina]

Hard subject though. I'm convinced my introduction to crappy formulas as an infant subjected me to food allergies and correlating mental conditions.

[eatyourbroccoli]

i've heard raw goats milk is closer to human breast milk. if breast feeding isnt possible, i'd look into that route.

infants are not meant to be vegan. breast milk isn't vegan, after all.

[coco]

infants are not meant to be vegan.

really? says who?

my breast milk is made exclusively for my baby, just as a cow or goat mama's boobie juice is made exclusively for her babies. a breast fed baby can still be called a vegan. veganism is a diet and lifestyle that seeks to exclude the use of animals for food, clothing, or any other purpose. i don't think your own mama is included in that definition.