help! need advice on type 2 diabetes/converting others to raw

[beckx]

i talked to my sister today and she was finally open with me about her health issues. she is dealing with around 125 pounds of extra weight, high blood pressure, severe type 2 diabetes, sleep apnea and other issues resulting from her weight and is told by her doctors that if she doesn't get things under control she has no option but to have gastric bypass as soon at the BEGINNING OF MAY. :( she's been working with a nutritionist since december who put her on a high protein diet; she has lost less than a pound (but still hasn't gained).

she is an amazing woman, i told her about raw and she is willing to give it a shot asap. i'm going to visit with her on sunday and prepare her a raw meal, show her some tricks for food prep... i'm going to bring her some raw cheeses and maybe a few other things and make her a really simple menu plan. she says she doesn't mind not eating foods she loves but really doesn't want to eat tons of foods she doesn't like so it sounds like raw might not be as hard for her as some, but the thing is due to her diabetes being so bad she really can't eat any fruit or sweeteners right now. again, she says she doesn't mind this but i still don't want to bring her a cookbook with lots of sweet recipes in it.

so my questions are:
-can any type 2 diabetics/former type 2 diabetics give input on things i should know when advising her on this diet change? especially re: medication... with diabetes the amt of insulin you take depends on your sugar levels at the time, right? she's on injection meds. i'm just worried that she'll need less but still take the same amount.

-can anyone give me tips on 'converting' someone to raw who is very new? i studied this lifestyle and dipped my toes in and out for almost three years before getting to high raw. success stories of converting a loved one with health challenges would help... i'm a little scared/nervous, this is my first time 'coaching'.

-she mentioned that some of her meds keep her from losing weight. is it possible that she might do this and lose no weight and have no benefits due to these medications? do you think with a raw diet she can turn things around (in less than a month) enough to convince her doctors that she doesn't need the surgery? any success stories with this would be great.

long winded but i can't quiet my brain about this, lots of chatter.

thanks so much in advance, everyone here is so great.

[Kalimelle]

I think he's had amazing success with diabetics on his program. Look for his Rainbow Green book, which has a 'phase' approach to going raw. In the first phase, you really limit fruits and sweets. Maybe this would be best for your sister?

[parsnip]

That's so great that you're so enthusiastic about helping your sister, and that she sounds like she's very open to it! I feel like I could pretty easily be in her situation, and that's my strongest motivation for going raw.

There's a documentary called "Raw for 30 Days" -- this is from the website: ""Raw For 30 Days" is an independent documentary film that chronicles six McDonald's-munching Americans with diabetes who switch to a diet consisting entirely of vegan, organic, live, raw foods in order to reverse diabetes naturally."

You can watch the trailer online, and possibly you can go to a showing locally (though I don't think it has much distribution at this point). The trailer doesn't give much in the way of specifics, but it's very inspiring. http://www.rawfor30days.com/Site/Raw_For_30_Days.html

[Aleesha Sattva]

if you email me at timelessspirit@shaw.ca i'll give you a private sneak peek at the next issue of my magazine. there's a wonderful article about this very topic!

[juliebove]

I'm a type 2 diabetic and soon to start insulin. I don't know that much about it, but I do know there are different kinds. I will be taking one shot per day, at night.

Some people take insulin with their meals and those people would adjust it to the amount of carbs with their meal.

It's possible your sister is on Byetta. That's not insulin but an injectible med for people with type 2. From what I understand, it slows digestion and can cause weight loss.

As for the high protein diet... One reason some diabetics are put on it is not because they need the protein but so they are not taking in too many carbs. Carbs are what raise blood sugar the most. It is possible to take in too many calories on a high protein diet and lose little to no weight.

Vegetables and fruits all contain carbs. Some more than others. So a diabetic who eats a raw diet would have to carefully plan their food choices and test their blood sugar to see how they react to various foods. Most diabetics find they can not eat much in the way of fruit, especially things like bananas and oranges.

I don't know what you mean by "severe" diabetes. There is no such thing really. Do you mean she already has complications? If so, then she might have to be careful with the amount of fiber she eats. If she has gastroparesis, she might not digest this well.

[shashibala]

As was posted above, Dr. Gabriel Cousens has done lots of research on reversing type 2 diabetes. He runs a doctor supervised retreat for diabetic people at the Tree of Life in Arizona. He recently wrote a book called There is a cure for Diabetes. Here is a link to his site:

http://www.treeoflife.nu/diabetes

Best wishes to you and your sister!!!!!

[beckx]

thank you, everyone for your advice and support. i am familiar with dr cousens and will pick up his rainbow green and the new book for her.


I don't know what you mean by "severe" diabetes. There is no such thing really. Do you mean she already has complications? If so, then she might have to be careful with the amount of fiber she eats. If she has gastroparesis, she might not digest this well.

hm, i meant that her blood sugar is completely out of control despite being on meds but this might present another problem. i'll ask her about complications. thank you for all of the diabetes info. are you raw and if so have you seen improvements in your sugar levels?

[Mump]

A person I started to coach was raw for several months, gaining weight most months, and didn't make much progress. After being raw on his own for six months he went to the doctor only to be told his sugar was very high and his blood was dangerously thick. Research turned up Dr. Gabriel Cousens' program. After three weeks of juice made from cucumber, celery and zuchinni his blood sugar has dropped from 350 to 120. On this he has dropped weight as well. This is major progress.

[raven]

I have Dr. Cousens' book, saw the short film and heard him speak. The testimonials were very dramatic and impressive. I'm sure most diabetic people would respond favorably. Perhaps you could contact Tree of Life for support.

Suzy

[beckx]

A person I started to coach was raw for several months, gaining weight most months, and didn't make much progress. After being raw on his own for six months he went to the doctor only to be told his sugar was very high and his blood was dangerously thick. Research turned up Dr. Gabriel Cousens' program. After three weeks of juice made from cucumber, celery and zuchinni his blood sugar has dropped from 350 to 120. On this he has dropped weight as well. This is major progress.

mump, was he on just that juice? or adding that juice to the diet?

[beckx]

I have Dr. Cousens' book, saw the short film and heard him speak. The testimonials were very dramatic and impressive. I'm sure most diabetic people would respond favorably. Perhaps you could contact Tree of Life for support.

Suzy

thanks for the input, suzy. maybe i will; or give my sister their number. maybe she'd even decide to spend some time there.

[Mump]

Once we reviewed the material from Dr. Cousens a green juice feast was started. Cucumber, Zuchinni and Celery were the picks as they are lower in Vitamin K. The vegetables with Vitamin K make his blood thicker which is something he has to avoid. The fruits adversely affected his sugar. With the juice he is not hungry, does not have cravings and is making the progress we all want to make. I've personally done the same juice and it taste refreshing and isn't hard to accept. I feel energetic on it as does he.

[Mump]

To be clear his intake is 100% juice.

[beckx]

Once we reviewed the material from Dr. Cousens a green juice feast was started. Cucumber, Zuchinni and Celery were the picks as they are lower in Vitamin K. The vegetables with Vitamin K make his blood thicker which is something he has to avoid. The fruits adversely affected his sugar. With the juice he is not hungry, does not have cravings and is making the progress we all want to make. I've personally done the same juice and it taste refreshing and isn't hard to accept. I feel energetic on it as does he.

that's great, mump. i love that juice combination too. what length was/is the feast? and since cucumber, zucchini and celery are very low calorie, how many ounces a day is he drinking? is this something dr. cousens discusses in the diabetes book?

thanks for the information; it might even be easier for her to transition from SAD to a juice feast rather than raw foods since there is no complicated prep and no grey area about what is/isn't raw... she won't have the overeating fats problem and it will undoubtedly give her the results she needs quickly to avoid having the surgery. juice feast was my first idea but i didn't want to be too radical in my suggestions to her... but maybe she needs something radical right now considering her situation.

i'm going on right now to pick up there is a cure for diabetes. hopefully i'll be able to find it; i got a copy for my father when it first came out but didn't get a chance to read it before i gave it to him... but it was difficult to find and i'm going to see my sister tomorrow (she lives about 2 1/2 hours away). crossing my fingers. thanks again!

[Theogirl]

I have no personal experience with this but I just got this link yesterday in one of my raw newsletters.
http://www.rawfamily.com/news/Raw%20Family%20Newsletter%20April%202006.pdf

Sounds amazing. There's so many people I know with diabetes but so many don't seem open to new ideas. And I don't want to preach at them, because it is a personal choice. Best wishes for your sister. Please keep us posted.

[Mump]

Sorry for the delay in responding, I was travelling. He is drinking at least 64 ounces of the green juice a day for an indefinite amount of time. His personal "traditional" doctor wants him to stay on this for three months and then will review his progress although when he first heard what he was doing he objected as it was unfamiliar to him. As I mentioned he has lost weight and has been able to get moving which was very difficult for him previously. I would suggest you read Dr. Gabriel Cousens There is a Cure for Diabetes. I personally don't recommend anything I myself wouldn't do so I have tried the green juice routine and like it very much. You feel refreshed, light and very energetic on it!

[beckx]

ok, so i went to visit my sister, we tried to make a meal plan... turns out the only foods she likes period are chicken, steamed green beans, cheese, carrots, iceberg lettuce, nuts and seeds, berries and grapefruit. and she does not like to combine the veggies/nuts into dishes. not sure what to advise at this point; its really frustrating. not at all her fault that she is a very picky eater, i just wish i knew what to tell her. i feel pretty useless, she's trying it but a raw diet with just the raw foods of those above isn't something i would advise to anybody. i was hoping after a few days she might feel open to trying new foods but doesn't seem likely. she's not open to veggie juice either.

any advice?

[parsnip]

Wow, that is frustrating. It sounds like she kinda wants the surgery -- maybe that's why she's not very motivated to try an all-raw diet?

I'm trying not to be too critical (I'm in no position to throw stones, truly), but does she really only eat the foods you listed? It seems that it would be hard to gain a lot of weight on just those foods. But if that's really what she wants to eat, it also doesn't sound terribly unhealthy -- the chicken and cheese are not the healthiest things ever, but if she's okay with low-fat ways of preparing the chicken, and going easy on the cheese -- it seems like she'd be better off than the typical SAD.

I think it's really admirable of you to try to see her point of view, and not push anything on her -- it doesn't sound like it would accomplish much and could just put a strain on your relationship. You really can't control what she decides to eat.

Have you tried selling her on the idea of just doing 30 days (or even less) as a test, to see what results she gets? I know for me, it's not so hard to do something for a relatively short period of time, even if it sounds really unappealling. And during that time maybe she could tolerate some foods she doesn't like, just for the experiment's sake. :)

[beckx]

Wow, that is frustrating. It sounds like she kinda wants the surgery -- maybe that's why she's not very motivated to try an all-raw diet?

I'm trying not to be too critical (I'm in no position to throw stones, truly), but does she really only eat the foods you listed? It seems that it would be hard to gain a lot of weight on just those foods. But if that's really what she wants to eat, it also doesn't sound terribly unhealthy -- the chicken and cheese are not the healthiest things ever, but if she's okay with low-fat ways of preparing the chicken, and going easy on the cheese -- it seems like she'd be better off than the typical SAD.

I think it's really admirable of you to try to see her point of view, and not push anything on her -- it doesn't sound like it would accomplish much and could just put a strain on your relationship. You really can't control what she decides to eat.

Have you tried selling her on the idea of just doing 30 days (or even less) as a test, to see what results she gets? I know for me, it's not so hard to do something for a relatively short period of time, even if it sounds really unappealling. And during that time maybe she could tolerate some foods she doesn't like, just for the experiment's sake. :)

the thing is she really doesn't want the surgery... at least she says she doesn't. she pretty literally only eats the things i listed... oh, cottage cheese too. and vitamin water. also the occassional cookies, bread or pizza but it sounds like she's 90% or more on the foods i listed. she says she's been eating this way since december and has only lost 1/10 of a pound... so she's not gaining weight. but because the chicken is the only 'questionable' thing that might be holding her back from progress (aside from that i think she's possibly wrecked her metabolism from not eating enough, which is a whole other issue that i thought also could be addressed through live foods) i thought it would be worth it to try even leaving out animal protein for a couple of weeks... i agree that her diet is definitely way better than the typical SAD and if she had more time i think she could make some progress eating this way, but i don't think its conducive to the healing she needs to do very quickly.

she has agreed to do raw for two weeks but i'm really worried that she might get sicker because she's hardly eating anything. maybe i could try again to explain to her that she needs to at least be eating dark greens (which she hates - green smoothies would be the obvious way to do it but she can't have that much fruit) and that she needs to eat way more calories. she won't do salad dressing and can't do smoothies so i'm kind of at a loss as to how else to add the calories; she's also the type to literally gag at foods/textures she doesn't like. i'll call her tomorrow and we'll try to continue to talk it out.

thanks for your insights, and if you have any more ideas please let me know. :)

[Vivid Lily]

Hello. I'm glad you're helping your sister. and I hope she accepts your help. I am diabetic. On insulin 5 times per day. for many years now. With high blood pressure and high cholesterol. Getting not much help from diabetic clinic, my family doctor and my endocrinologist . Their answer is always eat the SAD (STANDARD AMERICAN DIET) AND take insulin. Everything I ate (what they told me to eat) made my sugars go really high. therefore I had to take more and more insulin. I did that for along time. many years and just started to get fed up with feeling crappy and going nowhere just feeding my insulin habit. I started seeking help first looking at a diabetic website it helped me for awhile , then I realized I wanted more. I wanted to eat healthier not learn how to control my insulib habit. I on my own started to eat more salads and I felt better. Then I found this website (which I love) and read everything I could , and learned so much . It really just made so much sense. This is the only way to get off all the meds (including insulin)
I've been going to raw food classes. just 1 class once a month. But last week I asked for personal help with my diabetes. Ive written other places about this but I'm going for 5 weeks. once a week. Well the first week. I did terrific. all raw. I've never felt better. Lost 5 lbs. Blood pressure is better. My insulin was Long acting insulin at bedtime I took 12 units & in the a.m. another 6 units. Then with every meal I took 3 - 6 units with each meal depending on what I ate. After just 1 day of eating raw - I took 1/2 of everything. It was still too much. It's been 1 week today. I've stopped taking long acting insulin before bed & in the morning. And am only taking maybe 1 or 2 units with each meal. The only fruit I am eating is in the a.m. with my morning green smoothie. If you have any questions, feel free to ask. I would love to help your sister. Right now I'm really trying to help my daughter. She was gestational diabetic when pregnant with both of her kids. and now she is really overweight. It breaks my heart because I don't want to go down the same path as I did. I hope she will learn something from me. Now that I'm taking this seriously and she's seeing results from me . Now she's asking questions. Bye for now Suzy:D

[cayenne]

I haven't read the whole thread, so someone may have mentioned it already:

Be very careful with diabetic patients, the raw diet is extremely powerful, and it WILL bring her blood glucose down, may be sooner than you think. She will have to monitor her own bloodglucose at least daily, or may be twice daily depending on severity, so she can adjust her medication before she goes into a hypoglycemia.

I had an older lady under my care, who had been on medication for many years. After ONLY a few days she had a hypo and we had to reduce her medication by half. In less than a few weeks she had to discontinue her medication all together.

Another younger man on medication had to stop all his medication to prevent hypoglycemia, that was also after a short time, I think a few weeks.

Both of these patients were not even raw, far from that. All they did was change over to natural whole foods, and even that proved very effective.
So with raw it will be even more powerful.

Be careful!!!