what about calorie count?

[ANIMLOVER]

Here is the problem with raw Uncooked food and recipe books.

They are almost all full of FAT, almonds here, walnuts there, sunflower seeds, macadama nuts, almond butter......

And sweets - raisins, dates, and mroe dates...

With all this RICH food no wonder I actually GAINED weight within 2 months onthe diet. I read that if it's raw yuo can eat it - BULL. I gained 9 pounds!

I have been working out since 18 (i'm 37) and I also run marathons, I actually gained weight while training!!

Alissa I have your book, and a few other, I wish you and other cooks would PLEASE label the nutritional content of your recipes. I'm trying to follow my caloric intake with fitday, but every time I make flax crackers, or on of your Nutty rich FATTY desserts I am guess at the calories and fat content.

How many calories of flax crackers have anyway??

[Rawkinlocs]

One suggestion is that you could always eat a low-fat raw diet. The raw food recipes in the uncook books are designed for people who are transitioning from a SAD diet to a RAW way of eating and feel the "need" to replace old, familiar favorites with something for a more full feeling...something more substantial than the bare-boned basics of raw.

Many people have lost weight eating those foods that are nut/seed-heavy...some do not, at "first". Remember, your body is going to go through some major changes but it will stablize at some point during your rawness.

But alas, the recipes and such are not for everyone and not everyone fairs well eating them, not everyone likes them, not everyone feels the need for them.

There are many raw foodists who eat very simply and eat a very low-fat diet consisting of mainly fresh fruits, veggies, leafy greens, smoothies and a small amount of nuts/seeds here and there. That may be the ideal way for YOU too.

Do a search for and check out the websites of Dr. Douglas Graham, Roger Hanske, Nora Lenz; just to name a few as they are people who promote and personally live by low fat raw standards.

Save the recipes for special occasions or for those times when you really get tired of eating the basics and want something a little different.

But again, many people have had opposite results eating all of the recipes and things. There are some who WISH they would be able to gain a few pounds eating raw so they can stop hearing how they are too thin and look emaciated.

Raw eating isn't a one-size fits all...you have to find what works for you and your body to achieve your desired results, be it eating more or less of the heavy stuff, more or less greens, etc.

[ANIMLOVER]

Thanks for the reply.

Why don't chefs just label the nutritional value of their foods?

I find it hard to raid the cereal box at night, so am trying to make crackers and breads in my dehydrator.

Most breads are nasty - anyone got a low fat yummy recipe?

I'm still wondering the fat/calorie content of Alissas veggie crackers - which are delish by the way!

ALISSA please put food labels of your receipes!!

[Rawkinlocs]

Well.....

I can pretty much guess what type of response you're gonna get from Alissa because I've seen her responses to these types of questions before.

I won't touch on the subject and I know you are waiting to hear from her, so we'll sit back and wait for her reply.

But while we wait, here are a couple of threads that are somewhat similar in nature to yours - and you can see an example of what Alissa usually says in response to these types of "calorie" questions if you read on down through the posts.
http://rawfoodtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2816&highlight=calories
and...
http://www.rawfoodtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1227&highlight=calories

Enjoy! ;)

[Alissa]

lol, rawkie....
Animlover, i will never ever ever put food labels on my recipes. That is the POINT of raw food, you don’t have to count calories or fat or carbs or protein or weigh and measure your food.
There is no way you gained 9 pounds eating a 100% raw food diet, no way. You would be one in a million. I have a hundred guesses why you gained but unless i know what you were eating and what you were doing and who you are and your lifestyle i cant tell you. But i can guarantee that you where not doing it correctly.
Best,
Alissa

[rawpriestess]

I am with Alissa here,

I also write and sell raw un-cook books, and I will never put nutritional info in them, if someone wants this information, then they probably don't want to be making my recipes.

First, I use all raw, ripe, fresh, organic produce, nuts and seeds and the nutritional content of one lemon, may be different than another lemon, they may be ripened more or less, so one may have more sugar, or acid, or juice, etc.

So, if you were to ask me for my information, I'd say that's not part of my job description, my job is to make totally mouthwateringly delicious, raw food, that mimics it's cooked counterpart, but is so good for you and healthy, that you won't miss what you thought you used to like.

I also, find it very hard to believe that you gained 9 pounds eating raw food.

Now, I do know that muscle weighs alot more than fat per cup, so you could have lost fat and gained muscle, and stayed the same weight, because your were jogging.

You could have been eating what you thought was raw food, like frozen juices, or canned, or maybe essene breads, or even roasted almond butter, or maybe even canned fruits or roasted nuts.

The reason I say this, is I have taught raw food classes for 4 years, on and off, and the number one questions I hear, after the protein/calcium ones are: So, I can eat canned fruits and frozen hash browns right?

Well, of course you can, but you won't be eating raw.

so, what have you been eating, we might be able to help you out here, and find the culprit, or several.

once we identify the challenge, we can fix it, and you can eat raw, and loose weight, and all will be well with the world.

[VeganVixen]

hey!!!

I believe her!!! I have gained weight on this diet ,I lost weight afterwards when I cut out more nuts (and i wasnt eating many) - I think it was 6 lbs -even now I recently gained 3 lbs ,im usually around 130-134.5 ,and I dont eat nuts!........so I beileve her!



there are some really good low/er fat recipes on this board !


hope this helps! but this diet is NOT about numbers -but how you FEEL ,of course if you eat a cup of nuts your not going to feel good ,portion sizing should be based on that.......its liberating!

[simple berry]

whoa, why the automatic judgment?! i gained weight on a raw diet too. there was nothing pasteurised, nothing processed in my diet. goodness knows i wasn't doing three gourmet meals a day either -- although any gourmet food with all the nuts and oils really packs it on to my midsection.
now i have to stay under 1400 calories a day, or i gain weight. that's cool from a resource perspective, and completely fine if i'm doing physical work, but if i'm indoors and sedentary, i'm constantly thinking about food -- and the lower calorie requirement does make things harder for me on those occasions when i need comfort food, because there are so many interesting recipes i just have to skip. plus when i'm sedentary, a high-fat diet, even when it's all raw, changes the curvature of my spine!

i love raw foods! they have been instrumental in reclaiming my health. but for me calories do make a difference, and so do their sources. i would be very appreciative of a recognition of body differences in that regard -- and calorie counts on recipes.

[RawTruth]

Bear in mind - Alissa's statement concerns people who are 100% raw -- not "high" raw, not raw "except" for soy products, not 100% some days but not others. Not even 99% raw (how someone calculates this is beyond me, by the way). So ... my first question to anyone gaining so much weight would be about how long they were continuously and absolutely 100% raw.

And, VV, I'm wondering if your missing gallbladder might have something to do with your specific situation -- which is gotta be rather unusual and, perhaps, not really applicable to people who still have one. Hey, we know you're special! :D

(VV - 'course I'm no doctor -- just a guess/wondering.)

[Rawkinlocs]

whoa, why the automatic judgment?! i gained weight on a raw diet too. there was nothing pasteurised, nothing processed in my diet. goodness knows i wasn't doing three gourmet meals a day either -- although any gourmet food with all the nuts and oils really packs it on to my midsection.
now i have to stay under 1400 calories a day, or i gain weight. that's cool from a resource perspective, and completely fine if i'm doing physical work, but if i'm indoors and sedentary, i'm constantly thinking about food -- and the lower calorie requirement does make things harder for me on those occasions when i need comfort food, because there are so many interesting recipes i just have to skip. plus when i'm sedentary, a high-fat diet, even when it's all raw, changes the curvature of my spine!

i love raw foods! they have been instrumental in reclaiming my health. but for me calories do make a difference, and so do their sources. i would be very appreciative of a recognition of body differences in that regard -- and calorie counts on recipes.

...and this is why diet is not the only aspect of total well-being. Exercise, fresh air, sunlight, etc...it all plays a part. So, as you mentioned, Simple berry, it's when you're NOT active that you end up packing on the pounds.

I think that is the mistake a lot of people make. I can think of a couple of raw fooders that have been all raw for quite a long time (talking years) yet, they are not the totally thin folks most have come to associate with raw fooders. They're kinda on the thicker side, no muscle tone or definition. I am left to wonder if they are getting in any exercise at all.

But like RawPriestess said, there is the muscle mass to take into account when weighing in. Also, as I mentioned, the body is going to go through changes with weight fluctuations. Up, down, up, down, up, up, up then down, down...then one day, you notice that it's stable and no matter what you eat or don't eat, your body doesn't stray too far from it's ideal weight.

But we have to give the body TIME to get to that point. I understand why it's advised for people to toss out those darned scales because scales can lie, scales can deceive and scales don't know the difference between fat and muscle (unless you have a high-tech model that supposedly can determine all of that). But it can cause so much unnecessary frustration.

My question to those of you who gained all this weight, did your clothes size go up? Does your face look fatter or are you going solely on what the scale is saying? It's really kinda funny - to some, it's music to their ears that weight CAN be gained on a raw diet because most people think that eating this way means you're destined to be "too skinny" and emaciated.

But back to the calories...I, personally, just can't find it in myself to do all that counting of calories because for ME it then gets too complicated and can get too restricting and then it becomes like any other "diet plan" out there (Atkins, Weight Watchers, etc.) Eating the raw diet shouldn't even be in the same category as other "diets" because it's NOT a diet - it's a lifestyle. But I guess to those who treat it as a diet, then it becomes a diet to that person.

As I mentioned, a raw lifestyle - eating the NATURAL raw diet is for most, the ultimate goal. Sure in the early stages when we're just now coming off of eating bread, pasta, cakes and cookies, we may need all the recipes and dehydrated goodies, etc. but later on, when the body let's us know that it's time to stop improperly combining foods and that it is now able to get by on the more simple foods, then we are left with natures most perfect foods and we REALLY need not do all of that counting, etc. at that point because surely our animal friends do not concern themselves with such things but rather just eat what comes natural for them and they eat when they're hungry and eat until they are full...simple as that.

But for those who feel the need to count the calories, etc., there is no judgement if you choose to do that. But it's not mandatory that these everyday people (speaking of the raw chefs, uncooks and recipe creators) - who decided to play around in their kitchens to create raw dishes to satisfy their desire for cooked foods with raw foods and later decided to share those recipes with the rest of the world - to have to figure all of that out, especially if they are of the belief that a raw way of eating should eliminate that need to count this and that.

So, for the 'counters', thank goodness for fitday.com and other sites like it where you can do the counting and do the math.

[Pink_Berry]

haha.. i gained weight on this diet to...

eating NO nuts and seeds whats so ever..just fresh raw organic ffruits and vegies and greens!! my fat intake came from avocado which was only one a day....
i gain weight from eating to much fruit...

by the way.. no dehydrated crap either. to me thats just so unnatural. just as unnatural as eating loads of nuts. they dont do me good anyways so i have never been a big eater of them.
never a huge fan of dates either.. have only had maybe 10 in my lifetime total!

you CAN gain weight with ANYTHING you eat!
what a joke it is to say that you can eat all you want if its raw and not gain weight!! its just HYSTARICAL is what it is! LOL!!

if you eat more calories then your body is burning you WILL gain weight. no matter what you eat!
and i think it also depends on how your body burns sugar calories and how it burns fat calories. every body is different.

oh PS..
i was 100% raw for about 6 months total. during that time i was having to eat alot of sweet fruit.. to get the much needed calories in for energy. noticed i was gaining lots of weight, so i started eating more vegies and greens instead of the fruit, but that left me with no energy whats so ever. started eating more raw fat for more calories, which also just seemed to leave me with unwanted weight gain.
before that time i was high raw, with only brown rice being non raw for 8 months..
and before that i was very high raw.. about 95% for a year!

i dont know what percentage raw i am now, but i dont think i will ever go back to 100%.. or even extremely high raw.
I am still very high raw, but include protien, steamed bean sprouts, steamed sweet potatos and yams into my diet as a calorie source.. instead of the super sweet fruits and raw fats. i must say.. i feel FANTASTIC.. eating the way i eat :)and have lost lots of weight thus far!

[VeganVixen]

yep Rawtruth !!! I think my lack of a gallbladder makes it VERY hard for me to lose weight,not that Im overweight! I have to workout ATLEAST 5 hours a week to keep my weight stable ,lately Ive been lazy and VERY busy so I dont get much exercise! I plan on getting back down to 130-133 SOON !!!

It is hard going from 123(my pre op weight) to the 130's though!!!!

[Rawkinlocs]

VeganVixen, if you don't mind me asking, how tall are you?

I'm not asking this to pry, but I'm asking because - *sigh*, I've read and re-read the posts in this thread and my mind is racing.

I realized something in my inner thoughts...I wonder if some of us are not allowing our bodies to do what they are gonna do and be what they're gonna be. What I mean is, for example, the folks who are thin already and say, "I don't want to be 100% raw because I don't want/need to lose anymore weight!" I WAS this person. I was worried that I'd look all skeleton-like before it was all said and done because I was already on the small side when I started this out. I dropped from around 140 to 120 and I had not been smaller than 128 since before highschool. That kinda scared me, but I trusted that my body knew what it was doing and now, I'm between 124 and 126 which isn't too far off from where I was at age 18.

But again, there must come a time when the body will stablize to it's ideal weight and not every 5'ft 4" person will weigh the same. Again, I am 5'4" and I weigh around 124-126. But then I think Nutrimom is the same height and she weighs like, less than 110. For HER, that is ideal and for ME, this is ideal even though we're the same height. Our body frames/bone structures are probably different.

So, I wonder if WE end up putting these demands on our bodies that "I am gonna weigh this amount and I will eat more or eat less until I get to that weight!" When in fact, our bodies are doing what it needs to do and getting our weight to where it SHOULD be - and sometimes this might not be where WE want it to be or think it should be. Am I making ANY sense at all here?

So, the person who wrote the OP, we don't even know how how tall she is, how long she has been raw or to what extent they are raw - but perhaps the weight gain (while undesired by her) is what the body just needs to do for the time being and THEN later on, miraculously enough, the weight begins to drop off and stablize or perhaps it's where her body feels the ideal weight should be...who knows?

Also, I don't think Alissa or RawPriestess were saying that you can't gain weight on a raw diet but just found it hard to believe that the person gained 9 lbs (in what could be a short amount of time) eating a 100% raw diet.

I recall even reading in Living on Live Foods where Alissa mentions things about weight not coming off if eating too many nuts and fats and how sometimes you have to modify your diet.

But the statements of "eat whatever you want as long as it's raw" I think are made to people who are starting out so they can steer clear of SAD foods or cooked foods (if that's their goal, that is). The message seems to be, "Hey, you're coming off of a diet of pizza, burgers, fried foods and pastries so when you're first starting out, don't WORRY about counting calories and eating too much and eating too many nuts, etc. Just eat and eat RAW! Later on if the weight is still not coming off, we can work on tweaking your diet to include more fruits and greens and less nuts to get you where you wanna go."

That is how I am perceiving what I read in Alissa's and others' books when they make such statements.

[RawTruth]

I think focusing on weight - the actual pounds one weighs - can be counterproductive. I know people who've gone down in dress sizes even though the scale shows that they haven't lost weight when they started eating raw.

When I first started weight training 25 yrs ago (not recently!), which I did to gain strength so I could change my own tire, lift heavy things ... it was before female weightlifting became prominent, I accidently (!) changed dress sizes within 6 weeks of starting the class. Clothes started fitting differently, and, when I went shopping, I'd gone down 2 sizes. But! my weight hadn't changed. This was because of the muscle weight, 'course.

I know Catherinethegreat's face changed/slimmed down enormously, which is easy to see in her before, during, after picture collage even though, as I recall reading during her 30 Day Challenge, the weight was not falling off her like she'd hoped.

I assume that Alissa is so certain because of her extensive experience advising and consulting people in going and staying raw over a long period of time. Which is her profession, right? Perhaps, because she is hands-on with them, they avoid pitfalls that we untutored folk may unknowingly fall into .. and which may cause those who want to lose weight by eating raw to not attain their goals.

[VeganVixen]

rawkinlocs ,Im 5'6 -I do think obsessing about numbers is unhealthy, but when I get above 135 my stomach feels bloated and I just feel yucky! I know its not muscle because 3 lbs ago (a few weeks ago) I was muscular and excersisng - now Im not, Ive just been in a bit of a slump ,Im moving to ohio soon and am studying so I have a "mind block"-Im also VERY jaded with my surroundings .... and when I get home I feel too tired, ALSO my internal clock is a bit out of whack ,can you tell? ;)

It seems like when I start to eat greens I gain weight ,and when I eat fruits I lose! I dont add much oil ,it just seems backwards b/c fruits are more calorie dense!!! strange,but IM NOT giving up greens for 3 lbs !!theyre too yummy :)




I need to get back on the exercise wagon !

[Revvell]

Ditto.

And I shall add ~ folk seem to be treating this as a regular SAD. It's not. One does NOT have to count calories, carbs, fats, etc. One just has to eat raw ~ and often! What I have personally found is, at 100% I was maintaining excess flesh where I preferred it not to be. Part of the problem was that, in the midst of moving, other than the actual moving, I was getting less than optimal exercise and/or calories. Once we got in here, and I could prepare/eat more often, my body weight stabalized to where I'm happy with it ~ AND the cellulite is disappearing!!! Yayyyyy!

What many don't realize is when one restricts their calories, the body goes into "starvation" mode and hangs onto the fat. One of the ways to lose weight is to speed up the metabolism. The safest way is to eat often. Metabolism becomes slow if you skip meals ~ or restrict calories ~ as so many do when they want to lose weight. The slowing of the metabolic rate is a process that humans adapted to for survival in ancient times. If food is scare, the body perceives starvation and goes into survival mode. To make sure there is enough fuel to keep you alive, your body stores as much of the food as it can as fat and slows the rate at which it burns calories. Once metabolism slows down, it is extremely difficult to lose weight. The answer then, surprisingly is to eat more often. Even a small amount of cooked food at this time will slow down the weight-loss process.

Personally, for those who are sedentary, I wouldn't worry so much about a few pounds of added weight. What I WOULD concern myself with is the fact that, the lymphatic system, unlike the circulatory system, does not function without movement. The lymphatic system is the garbage system of the body and IF one doesn't get movement, your garbage does not get dumped. Could that be where the excess weight is hiding?

Revvell



I think focusing on weight - the actual pounds one weighs - can be counterproductive. I know people who've gone down in dress sizes even though the scale shows that they haven't lost weight when they started eating raw.

When I first started weight training 25 yrs ago (not recently!), which I did to gain strength so I could change my own tire, lift heavy things ... it was before female weightlifting became prominent, I accidently (!) changed dress sizes within 6 weeks of starting the class. Clothes started fitting differently, and, when I went shopping, I'd gone down 2 sizes. But! my weight hadn't changed. This was because of the muscle weight, 'course.

I know Catherinethegreat's face changed/slimmed down enormously, which is easy to see in her before, during, after picture collage even though, as I recall reading during her 30 Day Challenge, the weight was not falling off her like she'd hoped.

I assume that Alissa is so certain because of her extensive experience advising and consulting people in going and staying raw over a long period of time. Which is her profession, right? Perhaps, because she is hands-on with them, they avoid pitfalls that we untutored folk may unknowingly fall into .. and which may cause those who want to lose weight by eating raw to not attain their goals.

[simple berry]

pink berry, you're quite thin now, right? i'm glad you have been making the changes you needed to make and listening to your body. oftentimes it feels as though people can be automatically judgmental. I'm not trying to be critical of Alissa, whose work with people formerly dying of SADness i truly appreciate and admire. there are so many elements which synergise to create a person's reality, and it's hard for others to know everything relevant! i know i sure don't have the $ for consultations at this point.

i was not on anything like the sad diet before going raw - i did not eat pastries, cookies, cakes, pastas, etc. it was mostly organic whole foods. i don't eat crap and wonder why that's people's first assumption. however, ten years of hormones from birth control pills starting at a terribly young age really wrecked my body, as did a number of other pharmaceuticals. when my body gravitates back towards fatness, it is not towards any natural state of being -- i haven't been at that state since i was thirteen. and during the months where i gained the most weight -- which is measured not only with the scale, but with the mirror, the fit of my clothes, my posture, and my eyes -- i was eating 100% raw. and i was doing a lot of work with my body, not sitting still indoors as i tend to now while studying.
exercise makes me feel better, but i don't lose any weight doing it (20 to 40 minutes on an elliptical machine).
i also feel better when i cut nuts and seeds way, way down for extended periods, but i certainly don't want to lose the ability to digest fats. i did three liver flushes several months ago, after being told by a naturopath who's been listening to david jubb that i would need to do six or seven of them to reset my fat metabolism. i don't know if i'll do another one; the last felt poisonous. it's only now, months later, that i can stand the smell or taste of olive oil at all!


lately i have come down to 85%-90% raw and 100% vegan and it seems to be okay for me at the moment. i will be struggling with it still. raw foods are the only ones which actually work properly with my satiety centers. but i am trying to shake up my metabolism a bit, so that i'm not holding at 1100-1400 raw calories per day.

diet seems to make a big difference, so do thoughts, so does environment, so does lifestyle. right now i have to eat fewer calories with very few nuts and seeds and be active -- i.e. not sitting around studying then exercising -- to feel good. i am concerned about getting essential fats. and i am wishing that instead of having professional do-gooder aspirations, i could be happy doing physical labour three to five hours a day.

i don't restrict calories when i'm dieting. but i am not trying to go way upwards of normal requirements, as happens easily when recipes call for a cup of nuts here, a quarter cup of oil there, some seeds, some avocado, etc. etc. like animlover said, this is such a rich diet -- to me, the richest on earth, because nothing is corrupted by processing. i need fewer calories on a raw diet than i do on cooked, which Gabriel Cousens confirms -- he calls the raw diet a natural means of calorie restriction, which has been experimentally demonstrated to increase the lifespan in miserable laboratory animals. anyway, if that is true, it really doesn't make sense for raw recipes would be so calorifically dense.

usually people will say that the recipes are for transitions. but what about the rest of us? we are not all in a stage of transition from the worst of SAD to raw. However, many of us are continually transitioning between the SAD environment and our own boundaries without getting too self-involved.

sigh.

[Rawkinlocs]

Hey Simple Berry,

You're right, not everyone who begins to explore eating raw comes from the same, SAD background. I realize this and didn't mean to come off like every, single person who eats raw did. It's just that from what I've read, MOST (but definitely not all) people who do, did.

But you're right, each situation is different, each case of gaining excess weight is different and doesn't always come from the food choices. But at the same token, even coming off of a diet of eating whole foods, there's still brown rice, beans, hummus, (perhaps tofu), whole grain breads - all of which still make one feel more full than eating a couple of bananas here, some melon there and/or a salad; that is, until the body has had a chance to adjust to the lighter eating and better assimilation of nutrients.

So, again, there comes that "need/desire" for a feeling of fullness when first transitioning to a raw diet or a desire to eat the "gourmet" of raw be it for transitional purposes or merely out of boredom or maybe even curiosity; for SOME, perhaps not in your case, I don't know what your reasoning for gravitating to the recipes may have been- I'm merely speaking in general but know each case/person is different, right?

Maybe we should stop saying "transitioning from the SAD to RAW diet" but rather transitioning from a cooked to raw diet is better? Either way, there is still some sort of transition - one may be more difficult or more involved than the other depending on what was eaten prior to going to a raw way of eating.

But I guess all in all, it really just goes back to my very first post in this thread:


One suggestion is that you could always eat a low-fat raw diet. The raw food recipes in the uncook books are designed for people who are transitioning from a SAD diet to a RAW way of eating and feel the "need" to replace old, familiar favorites with something for a more full feeling...something more substantial than the bare-boned basics of raw.

Many people have lost weight eating those foods that are nut/seed-heavy...some do not, at "first". Remember, your body is going to go through some major changes but it will stablize at some point during your rawness.

But alas, the recipes and such are not for everyone and not everyone fairs well eating them, not everyone likes them, not everyone feels the need for them.

There are many raw foodists who eat very simply and eat a very low-fat diet consisting of mainly fresh fruits, veggies, leafy greens, smoothies and a small amount of nuts/seeds here and there. That may be the ideal way for YOU too.

Do a search for and check out the websites of Dr. Douglas Graham, Roger Hanske, Nora Lenz; just to name a few as they are people who promote and personally live by low fat raw standards.

Save the recipes for special occasions or for those times when you really get tired of eating the basics and want something a little different.

But again, many people have had opposite results eating all of the recipes and things. There are some who WISH they would be able to gain a few pounds eating raw so they can stop hearing how they are too thin and look emaciated.

Raw eating isn't a one-size fits all...you have to find what works for you and your body to achieve your desired results, be it eating more or less of the heavy stuff, more or less greens, etc.


P.S. I still contend that, while some say they gain (be it desired or undesired) weight eating raw, there are still many who have lost a lot of weight, even eating all the calorie-dense, rich, raw "gourmet" foods. But again, as you and others have done, some have to fine tune their diets and maybe cut back here and there on this or that.

[lovilla]

did your body need to gain 9 lbs?

[raeannasun]

I have been reading the posts and thought I would jump in with my *testimony*!!! I have had the opposite effect of SimpleBerry and Animlover. I started the raw food diet and have lost over 30 pounds!!! I have been eating a ton of nuts and just now noticed that my weight loss has slowed down, so I'm upping my greens and cutting the nuts. I can't believe the difference! It's been less than two months since the weight started coming off - I was 85% raw at first and I'm slowly getting to 100%. Yesterday I tried on some of my clothes that I've saved since high school and I'm so excited to get back into them!!! I also find it hard to believe that on 100% raw brought on unnecessary weight gain. If your body gained weight on 100% raw, it probably needed the weight!!! Or, you were eating too many nut and dried fruit products. Fredric Patenaude explains his weight gain on his website http://www.fredericpatenaude.com/ - he was 100% raw but eating lots of fats and nuts. Also, I have come to understand that on a 100% raw, you need to be listening to your body. I don't think that your body will crave fats and nuts unless you need them. There was a time a few weeks ago that I could really tell that I needed some nuts. I felt so much better after I ate them!!! Then the next week I was craving greens. I've become better tuned to what my body needs.
Simple Berry and Animlover, I hope you all can start fresh and try 100% again with success. Have you read any of Victoria Boutenko's books? I also suggested on the Master Cleanse thread that mono eating may be the next step for you in your weight loss and health. That's my goal.

[Sweet lips]

I have been reading this and thought ummmm - well at least this discussion has not turned nasty - and so I feel comfortable writing.

I am missing several body organs - one of which is my gall bladder -I have found beyond the physical aspect, there are other aspects that affect my weight loss and/or weight gain - this information rung a bell in me when I read the comments on the weight issues. I want to be clear here, I am not talking about anyone specific, I am just talking about what I am talking about and I am talking from my ]own life experience \
Simple berry, I copied down your quote - about not everyone is tranisitioning, from the lowest of low (my interjection) in food, but nevertheless transitioning and yes, I agree with that, however, I would like to say, transition is just that moving from the know to an unknown, so once you have moved into the known, the knowledge of - you may have gained experience as to what works for you and what doesn't. I beleive that there are more of us neededing instructions than those who do not, thus the reason for the information being stated as such. I don't beleive it is designed to be any other way, but to help somebody if they can.

As for nutitional content- there are free programs to assist you in such, while it will take time, if you feel the need, the tools are there. The Patent and Trademark and copyright function of the Federal government does not make that a mandatory requirement, only if it is a specific service cookbook, like for diabetics, etc - then it needs to be there/http://csis.pace.edu/~dsachs/nustud.html, http://www.bodiesofstone.homestead.com/saladcalories.html,
http://www.nal.usda.gov/fnic/etext/000020.html

Since the gall bladder chakra follows this pattern: The belly is the feeling center, the place where many of our emotions and passions originate. When something happens in our lives that creates emotions, these emotions seem to "grow" out of our guts and spread out through out bodies and psyches to whatever path is appropriate for their expression. Emotions are energy in motion and once created they will attempt to release themselves unless restricted by conflicting beliefs and mechanisms. Unexpressed emotions, such as anger, when repressed may stick in your "gut" and the tension may become stuck, creating a chakra block.

EMOTIONAL RESPONSES: Fear, wanting to stop the process, felt a lack of love as a child, defeated, a feeling of "what’s the use, it won’t work anyway, anger, burning up, bitterness, hard thoughts, condemning, prideful, gripping, undigested ideas, prolonged uncertainty, feeling of doom, dread, anxiety, griping and grunting, denying your own power, criticism, disappointment, failure, shame, childlike reacting, unresolved anger, chronic complaining, justifying, fault-finding to deceive self, feeling bad, wallowing in the gummed mire of the past, rejection, a belief of not being good enough, anxious to please.

Not expressing strong emotions, such as love, anger, fear, Suppressing, denying, holding in feelings, limiting expression of emotions and passions.

Feeling disempowered in your life. Not taking what is rightfully yours. Not supporting others you love in their personal empowerment.

Feeling conflicted between how you are and how you are "supposed" to be.


PHYSICAL EFFECTS: jaundice, shingles, gall bladder problems, liver conditions, fevers, low blood pressure, anemia, poor circulation, arthritis, stomach troubles, indigestion, nervous stomach, heartburn, dyspepsia, ulcers, gastritis, lowered resistance to diseases, allergies, hives, kidney troubles, hardening of the arteries, chronic tiredness, nephritis, pyelitis, acne, eczema, boils, rheumatism, gas, sterility, spastic colon, abdominal cramps, pancreatis, ulcers.

AREAS AFFECTED: gall bladder, small intestines, lymph circulation, kidneys, ureters, adrenal and supra-renal glands, spleen, pancreas, duodenum, stomach, liver, solar plexus, blood, gall bladder, common duct.

PHYSICAL CHARACTERISTICS: problems in this area are difficult and not always obvious as most problems are internal. In general, physical armoring can show up as weight gain or loss. Look for protruding or collapsed. Note areas of pain, tension and discomfort.











lately i have come down to 85%-90% raw and 100% vegan and it seems to be okay for me at the moment. i will be struggling with it still. raw foods are the only ones which actually work properly with my satiety centers. but i am trying to shake up my metabolism a bit, so that i'm not holding at 1100-1400 raw calories per day.

diet seems to make a big difference, so do thoughts, so does environment, so does lifestyle. right now i have to eat fewer calories with very few nuts and seeds and be active -- i.e. not sitting around studying then exercising -- to feel good. i am concerned about getting essential fats. and i am wishing that instead of having professional do-gooder aspirations, i could be happy doing physical labour three to five hours a day.

usually people will say that the recipes are for transitions. but what about the rest of us? we are not all in a stage of transition from the worst of SAD to raw. However, many of us are continually transitioning between the SAD environment and our own boundaries without getting too self-involved.

sigh.

[Pink_Girl]

Well there are some very interesting posts here. Now I am not yet 100% raw BUT the only cooked thing I eat is 1 slice on homemade bread (I grind the organic flour myself and it contains no butter eggs or milk!!) I have about a teaspoon on jam but no butter.
The rest of my diet is all raw. I have gained a tremendous amount of weight in the last couple of month. Now let me point out that I am normally 115lbs 5"5 and can eat like a horse (SAD diet) and never gain any weight. Now I have gone from a size 2 to a size 10 in 2 months!!!!! It is all fat!!!! It hangs off my gut and thighs I can literally grab handfuls of fat on my stomach!! I put in my food in at fit day and found out that even with VERY few nuts and avocados I was at 40-50% fat and 30-50% protein. I have seriously changed my diet. I eat fruits and veggies and juice wheat grass. Yesterday I had no nuts or avocados (a little dressing on my salad though) and I was at 23% fat 15% protein and 62% carbs. I am hoping that my weight gain will stop at this percentage.
So some you might be able to eat anything but others and still going to have to be very careful.
Pink_girl

[PaulieWalnuts]

At frist when reading these posts I couldn't believe that there were people who were gaining weight eating all raw. I personally have never seen that happen. But then I was thinking back to when I saw the Butenkos giving a lecture and I remember thinking that they (especially Viktoria) were quite a bit overweight and didn't look really all that healthy to me. I don't mean that as an insult to the Butenkos at all and I hope it didn't come off as such, but I do remember that that was the impression I was left with during and after their lecture. And then also when I saw David Wolfe he seemed....well, a little doughy, for lack of a better word. His stomach was hanging a bit over his pants and he sort of had a bit of man-boobs. I was shocked because I expected him to be super fit.
Then, on the other hand, you have Alissa who looks absolutely amazing: fit, healthy, and at a perfect weight.
Do you guys think this has to do with exercise? I know that Alissa is very into exercise while on the other hand I've never head Wolfe or the Butenkos take on it.

I'm hoping that Allisa will comment again on this because it's still very hard to believe that people could or would gain so much on raw.

Take care,
Paulie

[Revvell]

When I saw Viktoria a few weeks ago, I metioned the same thing to Catherine the Great and she explained why ~ which I can't remember. I've seen pics of the Boutenkos when they were out hiking, etc.

I'm thinking that, sometimes folk get so caught up in business that they don't really take care of themselves AND, for many, they get into what is called an upper limits question. Meaning, there's a part of them that refuses to let them be, do and have what it is they espouse. I know because this is what I've had to face as do many of my clients.

Eating raw will bring up a lot of mental/emotional stuff that folk have not ( and may not be willing to ) faced. Being successful will add to that. IF one doesn't understand upper limits, then, they will ~ often unconsiously ~ do something to bring themselves down to a more comfortable level.

That's what often happens when folk lose a lot of weight. They've not handled the mental/emotional aspects of how/why they gained it in the first place so, go back to the more comfortable place they were.

Revvell

[Sharon in Colorado]

Haven't read this whole thread yet, but wanted to throw in my own experience about weight. I'm 6'0 and weight between 142-148. I can weigh myself in the morning and then in the evening and be 5 pounds heavier. A lot of it is water weight. If you are eating salts or spices, that could be a culprit. It causes you to retain water as a way of diluting the toxins.

Many of you prob remember me writing this Dr. D. quote before:



"The solution to pollution is dilution"

If you try avoiding anything salty, spiced or seasoned in general, you may see your weight stabilize.

Also this is the way you lose/gain weight:

1) Water
2) Fat
3) Muscle

The water weight is ALWAYS the first to come/go. When people lose weight in their first month, it's always the biggest loss, and it's water. Fat is much slower which is what the consistant people losing weight let go of month after month. Then, of course is muscle, and that is usually from starvation, which happens rarely.

Remember, water retention many times brought on by foods, hormones, cycles, etc. will cause you to gain and lose several pounds quickly. Always weigh yourself at the same time of the day to get consistant readings.

[Rawkinlocs]

Beautiful post Sharon! Thank you for sharing that :)


Haven't read this whole thread yet, but wanted to throw in my own experience about weight. I'm 6'0 and weight between 142-148. I can weigh myself in the morning and then in the evening and be 5 pounds heavier. A lot of it is water weight. If you are eating salts or spices, that could be a culprit. It causes you to retain water as a way of diluting the toxins.

Many of you prob remember me writing this Dr. D. quote before:



If you try avoiding anything salty, spiced or seasoned in general, you may see your weight stabilize.

Also this is the way you lose/gain weight:

1) Water
2) Fat
3) Muscle

The water weight is ALWAYS the first to come/go. When people lose weight in their first month, it's always the biggest loss, and it's water. Fat is much slower which is what the consistant people losing weight let go of month after month. Then, of course is muscle, and that is usually from starvation, which happens rarely.

Remember, water retention many times brought on by foods, hormones, cycles, etc. will cause you to gain and lose several pounds quickly. Always weigh yourself at the same time of the day to get consistant readings.

[ANIMLOVER]

Hello

From my small world, I am the most active and healthy person I know

I gave the 100% RAW FOOD diet a shot about 6-8 months ago. Previously I was a vegan.

At the time I was working out 5 times a week at the gym, 2 hour sessions. I hour weight, 1 hour cardio. Then I decided to train for a marathon because I wanted to try to qualify for the Boston marathon.

In the process of training for a marathon I gained weight eating raw food only, so on my third month raw I decided to go back to vegan (low fat)

I posted my average daily diet consumption on another post (the master cleanse) and Alissa edited it out. I'm a bit dissappointed this happened!

I ended up qualifying for boston and continue to weight train, do spin classes, bike outdoors and run.

Now I'm not saying I't fat, but I expected to be at least leaner than on my vegan diet. I'm 5'7"
I was down to 126, 16% body fat.
I ended up being 135, 22% body fat!!

My body responded to weight loss on a vegan, high bean diet.

On raw I sprouted beans, alfalfa, and ate and juiced greens, alissa's delish flax seed crackers, lots LOTS of fruit! (bananas) and maybe too many nuts. I also supplemented with chorella and spirulina.

I agree that emotional eating is a BIG culprit to the weight gain, On a vegan diet I could just eat popcorn, or rice cakes to fill me up. On raw I crave wheat - dehydrated bread and crackers - 1tbs of flaz seeds has 67 calories!! Included in this almost every recipe has nuts, seeds and dried fruit added!
Even when I eat fruit, I eat about 4-5 apples or 3-4 bananas in one sitting to feel full. each piece of fruit is aobut 100 calories!

I would like to make a plea to Alissa - PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE write a LOW FAT raw cook book!

My probelm as I see it is I am now addicted to nuts and nut butters. But it is obvious that my body stores fat - a moment on the lips....
I'm just always hungry without the fat!

I am going to start a journal soon, maybe in june in preparation to my Master cleanse experiment.....

[Pink_Girl]

Well I posted before and would like to add that I am just as active as I was before I started eating this way. I do notice however that I am eating more calories than most of you. I eat between 1700 and 2000 calories a day BUT if I do not eat this much food I don't even come close to meeting my RDA's in vitamins and minerals. Even at this much food I still am ALWAYS low in B-12, Calcium, Zinc and selenium and am considering supplementing these vitamins and minerals anyways. Now if I cut my calories down I will have to make up for it in a multi vitamin. This was the whole point of eating this way. To get off all the supplements ect. I am not an emotional eater so this is not a problem for me either. So in order for me to get the vitamins and mineral I need to stay healthy I need to consume 1700-2000 calories a day.(and still supplement some). I also know that the Canadian food guide recommends that no more that 30% of our calories come from fat. Now I do not hold much to these guys and would guess that this is a very cushioned number and that we probably should be eating quite a bit less that 30%. Eating very few nuts I was still at 40-50% fat. I definably do not think that this is healthy to say the least and I am sure this is why I have stuck on sooooo much weight.

pink_gril

[Sharon in Colorado]

I would like to make a plea to Alissa - PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE write a LOW FAT raw cook book!

Dr. Doug Graham has a low fat raw recipe book. It is called the High Energy Recipe Guide. Try his site. www.doctorgraham.cc You may also be interested in his message board called "raw food and sports" on www.vegsource.com

With any kind of low fat raw diet, you're going to have to get used to more fruit, mono-mealing and salads, and less nuts & dehydrated foods.

[Autumn]

I thought the way raw worked is that it stabilized your body weight (after the healing process was completed) to what your body (in its infinite wisdom) knows it should be. Meaning, if you gain weight, you needed to gain weight, if you lost, you needed to lose.

According to "the charts" and various doctors, I am supposed to weigh anywhere from 125 to 165. That's a big difference! That's why I don't listen to charts or doctors. I will let my body decided when it's damn good and ready. Hee!

By the way, I found it interesting to read about what lack of a gallbladder supposedly does to a person. I haven't missed mine in 14 years. :p

[raeannasun]

http://www.living-foods.com/articles/proteincontroversy.html

I've refrained from posting until now......this article also talks a lot about calories. I think it's pertinent to this discussion! :)

[Rawkinlocs]

I thought the way raw worked is that it stabilized your body weight (after the healing process was completed) to what your body (in its infinite wisdom) knows it should be. Meaning, if you gain weight, you needed to gain weight, if you lost, you needed to lose.

According to "the charts" and various doctors, I am supposed to weigh anywhere from 125 to 165. That's a big difference! That's why I don't listen to charts or doctors. I will let my body decided when it's damn good and ready. Hee!


Where is the high-five smiley when you need it? Right-ON girlfriend! :cool: But it does take some longer to get to the point of really trusting the body to do what it needs to do. Again, when you treat eating raw like a "diet", then you are bound to all the old conventional dietary rules, regulations and laws. I have just personally chosen to free myself and my mind from all of that and allow nature and my body to take it's course. I just trust eating natural and trust that as a result, my body will do what is necessary.

[Revvell]

.... does take some longer to get to the point of really trusting the body to do what it needs to do. Again, when you treat eating raw like a "diet", then you are bound to all the old conventional dietary rules, regulations and laws. I have just personally chosen to free myself and my mind from all of that and allow nature and my body to take it's course. I just trust eating natural and trust that as a result, my body will do what is necessary.


Nod,nod,nod.

:D

Revvell