Raw? Or What?

[rawpriestess]

RAW? Exactly what is eating raw?

Some feel it is 100% eating raw food or you aren't raw.

Some feel it is 100% raw & living food, or you arent' raw, ie adding in miso, kim chee, fermented foods.

Some feel it is 50% raw fruits and veggies added to a regular Vegan Diet.

Some feel it is 75% raw fruits and veggies and some vegetarian foods.

Some feel it is eating raw dairy and meat in with your fruits and veggies.

Some feel it is ONLY fresh fruits and veggies, nut and seeds with NO processing, like dehydrating.

Some feel you shouldn't eat onions or garlic.

Some feel you shouldnt' eat too much fruit.

Some feel you shouldn't eat too many nuts, avocados or oils.

Some feel you shouldnt' eat grains.

When I first went raw, I thought it was 100% or nothing. I beat myself up because I wasn't perfect, and when I found out that cashews weren't raw, and my olive oil may not be raw, and my olives may not be raw, I felt like I had been violated, cheated, and lied to.

That was 4 years ago, I went of the raw wagon, because most books, most teachers, and most raw websites told me to do something different, and I just couldn't figure it out.

So, I read, and talked and learned for 4 years, then decided that TO ME, raw was eating 100% Raw, Fresh, Ripe, Organic fruits veggies, nuts, seeds and grains, with some dehydration, some fermentation, and some freezing.

Personally, I think that each person is on their journey, or in process/progress of being raw.

I am here to support YOU in whatever you choose to do, and if you have questions, then I will answer them to the best of my abilities, of course using my personal BS (belief structure) and opinions.

We are on this board to support the raw vegan lifestyle, and to find out more about it, to share our experiences and to help each other.

Personally, I see no reason to catagorize someone as RAW, because they are a certain % of what someone thinks is supposed to be raw.

If you are here on this board, and you are looking to be healthier, try this lifestyle for 30 days, as Alissa suggests, then make your decision if it works for you.

If it works, keep it, if it doesn't work, then you can start eliminating grains, or nuts, or whatever.

Just a thought:
Juliano uses maple syrup, which is cooked for 40 hours in his recipe book, but he still named the book RAW.

[Rawkinlocs]

Great post RawPriestess!

I had thought about some similar things one time before. I know I've read that a person is considered to be a raw foodist as long as 75% percent of their daily diet is comprised of raw foods.

Part of me can get with this and part of me cannot. The part that cannot is the same part of me that realizes that, some people say, "Oh I'm a vegetarian...BUT, I eat fish (or chicken or both)".

So, (thinking out loud here) can someone who eats chicken and fish at every meal be considered a vegetarian if we look at the "true" definition of vegetarian and/or vegetarianism?

Can a person who eats no meat (fish and poultry), eggs, honey, doesn't wear leather, use products made with animal products, etc. BUT still consumes a small amount of dairy products be vegan?

It's interesting. Most would not call those people vegan or vegetarian if they are still eating those things - but with being raw or raw vegan, eating certain amounts of cooked foods...you're still raw.

But you make excellent points about some of the condiments and things we "raw foodists" use that aren't raw. So, because we decide to not eat things that WE cook ourselves, but eat things such as "not-truly-raw" cashews, maple syrup, dried herbs, raisins, and other things that may or may not be TRULY raw - does that make us any less raw?

It's such an interesting thing RP! I guess to some, the only TRUE raw fooders are those who consume ONLY fresh fruits, veggies and deshelled nuts/seeds. LOL!

I guess that's why I don't care for labelling myself a vegan or a vegetarian or a raw fooder/foodist because it can get a bit confusing. But again, I guess like you said, it's about what being raw is to YOU (ME).

One more little thought that just came to me - I wonder if there is a difference with the person who eats basically all raw most of the time, but then every so often - like a few times a year - eats something cooked as opposed to the person who eats basically all raw most of the DAY and then eats something cooked at dinner or eats something cooked once or twice a week.

Sorry for all the thinking out loud!

[sara]

I guess one question (of many) I have is this: I do use cashews and maple syrup because I found them in Julianno's and Alissa's cookbooks. Will that keep me from reaping the full benefits of a raw lifestyle by comsuming them? Or does it even matter? And while I'm asking. I watched Dr. Oz on Oprah yesterday. I felt he actually supported a vegetarian lifestyle, but sings the praises of salmon. Fish is the only thing I truly miss. Maybe if I learn something negative about consuming it, it will help. Any thoughts?
Thanks

[Rawkinlocs]

I guess one question (of many) I have is this: I do use cashews and maple syrup because I found them in Julianno's and Alissa's cookbooks. Will that keep me from reaping the full benefits of a raw lifestyle by comsuming them? Or does it even matter? And while I'm asking. I watched Dr. Oz on Oprah yesterday. I felt he actually supported a vegetarian lifestyle, but sings the praises of salmon. Fish is the only thing I truly miss. Maybe if I learn something negative about consuming it, it will help. Any thoughts?
Thanks

It very well could make a difference. I've read some raw fooders who went from eating all of the prepared meals and using condiments to eating a more pure diet and say it makes a great difference in how they feel/felt. I guess it really depends on the person. I think that when Alissa or others say that it makes all the difference in the world is really for the benefit of those who say, "I've been eating 80-95% raw and I don't notice any difference or I STILL have ______(insert any ailment)". The message sent to them is, "Try being 100% to see if it makes a difference."

So, let's say you're raw and you're eating (not-truly-raw) cashews and using maple syrup in recipes and you have something going on in your body you were hoping eating raw would help with, but it doesn't seem to be helping...perhaps eliminating those things - if only for a season - might make the difference.

But, if you are eating raw and using/eating the cashews and maple syrup and have absolutely no issues or problems with it...then it works for you.

As for the fish, from what I've heard/read, it's the mercury in the water that is also ingested by the fish that makes it dangerous for us.

[ren]

I guess one question (of many) I have is this: I do use cashews and maple syrup because I found them in Julianno's and Alissa's cookbooks. Will that keep me from reaping the full benefits of a raw lifestyle by comsuming them? Or does it even matter? And while I'm asking. I watched Dr. Oz on Oprah yesterday. I felt he actually supported a vegetarian lifestyle, but sings the praises of salmon. Fish is the only thing I truly miss. Maybe if I learn something negative about consuming it, it will help. Any thoughts?
Thanks

If you are going to eat fish, eat only wild salmon. No farm fish. That's as bad as eating farm chickens. You can get raw cashews, just soak them a bit to make it easier on the tummy. Also, maple syrup is raw at least the stuff I get. I find that not worry about going 100% has helped me go farther towards a 100% goal :D Does that make sense? LOL

[VeganVixen]

I used to eat fish rarely (sashimi or sushi style ONLY ,I love sushi -it was the hardest for me to give up) AND I said to people who asked if I was a vegetarian ,and I said I was more vegetarian than not .......and fish was the ONLY thing keeping me from vegan -now I know what to say -Im vegan ,but what does that mean? animal-freindly or purely non-animal ??? Some people have loved hand raised goats that they milk -Should that be shunned by vegans? Especially when A LOT of sad vegans use soy products with hidden milk durivatives and junkfood (like chips)that probably use animal fats ........

[catherinethegreat]

I think labeling can be dangerous territory especially if it starts pulling you toward judging others for how they define themselves.

Sara - If you are intuitively feeling that you want to eat the salmon - then eat it. EVERYONE is going to have an opinion and there are MANY people who are "authorities" on raw foods and it is really up to you to trust yourself to make the best decision for you.
You can try a week with salmon and a week without and see if you feel different - or if you feel something on a deeper level that tells you which is best for you.
I saw that Oprah show too. I thought it was interesting that they NEVER talked about live enzymes in raw foods helping heal people from ailments.
They did discuss different foods that have healing properties - but never touched on live enzymes. They are the authority - yes it's true - based on what they have experienced - the education they have - etc.
If you were to have a panel of those two guys with other authorities like RAW food authorities - you would hear so many points of view and beliefs and truths. I think what they said on that show was very informative. It also is the same thing as saying that everyone should eat 100% raw without looking into each persons background - it's just another blanket statement that each person needs to educate themselves about before just doing it because someone said so.

THAT is where it comes down to educating yourself and not putting yourself into any box that defines you ie: Raw, SAD, vegetarian, Vegan etc. I am finding more power in calling myself a human who makes choices every day about what would be best for my body based on what I've read - heard - educated myself about - and learned from my doctor and experienced for myself - then to try to fit myself in a box/ label.

I think it can be confusing because everyone has a different point of view.
And when it comes down to it - none of that matters.
If it is healing and healthy for you - then that is the best answer.

*c

[raeannasun]

Although I haven't been "raw" for very long, I plan on sticking with this way of eating to see where my journey takes me!

I don't think I'll ever call myself a "raw foodist", "vegan" or "vegetarian" - it is what I eat but I am "RaeAnna" who happens to eat raw food!! When people ask me what I'm doing to look so good I just tell them that I'm eating raw foods and vegetables and refer them to this site and www.living-foods.com! So far I've converted my mom and a friend at school!!! All within a month! Woo hoo! Who knows what will happen with even more time!

I also just got Alissa's book and it really inspired me when I was in a bunch of pain last night (detoxing). I read the section on detoxification and it reassured me that this was my body's way of becoming whole and healthy! All those years of bad eating and antibiotics are coming out!

I love this community and how everyone encourages each other in a better lifestyle!!! We are all taking a better road in our journey to health!

[Sweet lips]

then decided that TO ME, raw was eating 100% Raw, Fresh, Ripe, Organic fruits veggies, nuts, seeds and grains, with some dehydration, some fermentation, and some freezing.

Personally, I think that each person is on their journey, or in process/progress of being raw.

I am here to support YOU in whatever you choose to do, and if you have questions, then I will answer them to the best of my abilities, of course using my personal BS (belief structure) and opinions.

We are on this board to support the raw vegan lifestyle, and to find out more about it, to share our experiences and to help each other.

If you are here on this board, and you are looking to be healthier, try this lifestyle for 30 days, as Alissa suggests, then make your decision if it works for you.

If it works, keep it, if it doesn't work, then you
Just a thought:
Juliano uses maple syrup, which is cooked for 40 hours in his recipe book, but he still named the book RAW.

Amen to that! As you can see, I quoted what hit me hard as the truth-now, I add to one of your statements - If it works, keep it, if it doesn't work, then you make a choice as to what will work for you, and please do not knock this if it doesn't work for you.

[catherinethegreat]

"you make a choice as to what will work for you, and please do not knock this if it doesn't work for you."

Well said.

[vegangelist]

interesting thought:

not wanting to go with labels or anything. but, victoria boutenko and alissa and others mention the huge difference between 99 and 100 percent. but then, alissa's book and others, (can't remember about the boutenko books since i haven't looked at those as recently) call for things that are not "raw". for example: bragg's (not raw), maple syrup (not raw), miso (living but not raw), dried coconut (very hard to find truly raw), raisins (again, much harder to find truly raw), cashews (ditto on the hard to come by "truly" raw). so, based on these recipes, made as written you are still not 100 percent raw by strict standards. so, where does the 1 percent difference lie? and, i am not disputing that there is a big jump between 99 and 100. but, what defines (hating to define it strictly but...) 100 percent?

just some pondering.

kristi

[growinhealth]

Golly I have been thinking about this all week,I love raisins, mapple syrup, and sprouted bread oh and raw cashews. How is it that they aren't raw if it says they are raw on the package and everything? I am so confused I am on my second full day of raw and doing well, but now I am sort of discouraged about the raw cashews because i thought what a find! Anyway I really want to live a healthy lifestyle and to lose some of this excess baggage, will using mapple syrup, "not so raw" cashews and raisins not help? Just some questions about all this sorry guy's I don't know if this post belongs in this thread or somewhere else. Is sprouted 7 grain bread raw?

[PixieGreen]

Might as well jump into the frying pan, I see I have excellent company. :)

Bottom line: It doesn't serve me to label anyone else. It neither contributes to my emotional or physical health, nor does it lead to spiritual enlightenment.

When I think about how other people are living the raw lifestyle it helps me insofar as I can compare it to my own experience. I can learn from others' mistakes and successes. But to judge others, even to label them a one percentage of raw or another does not assist me on my path.

There is no "really raw." "Raw" as a concept is a human invention designed to dfferentiate people based on how they eat food. Like all such categories it is helpful for studies [official or anecdotal] to discover what helps/ hinders our health. It is a helpful signpost to find other like-minded people. But humankind is made up of such disparate bodies, cultures, and geographic differences, we cannot ultimately be classified, nor do I think attempting to do so is productive.

If someone says they are 80% raw and they identify themselves as a raw foodist, good for them. If they are 25% raw and self-identify as a raw foodist, rock on. It has nothing to do with me. It doesn't matter if the rest of their food is from taco bell or all organic steamed produce. Ultimately, it doesn't matter. It doesn't take anything away from those of us who are 90/95/100% raw. If that same person comes here asking for advice because they are suffering from ill health, suggesting that they increase their percentage of raw foods is a natural progression [especially on a raw foods forum!]. But deciding what constutues "really raw" is just an excuse to take the focus away from our path as individuals.

I was vegetarian for 7 years some time ago [pre-raw]. Most of my friends were too, we all worked at the natural health foods store. I noticed then that after people have adopted food lifestyles like this for awhile other people ask their advice and we start to think of ourselves as "experts." Beware! Our egos are tricky creatures just waiting to jump. It can be a real trip to watch someone else take your advise, but we must be careful to qualify our statements as "such-and-such has worked *for me*," instead of implying that if others don't do exactly what we do they are not legitimate.

Is the real reason this rankles some of us because it threatens our own self identity? People who used to identify themselves as "vegetarians who eat chicken" used to bother me to no end. Because where was my credit for eating grilled cheese sandwiches every time I went out to eat [midwest town. lots of steak, salads were mayo pasta and iceburg lettuce. blech.]?! What about the sacrifices I'd made! :)

I don't mean to imply that I don't also struggle with these issues. But one of the advantages of an online forum is that we have ample time to think and process before we post. It's saved my bacon a time or two.

Christa

[misslinda]

Rawpriestess: Thank you soooooooooo much for illustrating this for us---you're right, there is so much dialogue about percentages of being raw that we're missing the point at times. I just spent 3 hours at the grocery store b/c I was terrified of buying even raisins----want to stay as pure as possible so walked back and froth and stod there in aisles just thinking!?!??!?!?!

Your post was PERFECTLY well said.

Muchos Gracias!

:)

[sweetgoddess]

RawPriestess, Catherine, PixieGreen~~ Hallelujah!

[sara]

Wow! Did I learn a lot from this thread. You guys are full of such good information. You should be proud! :p However, I just visited the PETA website for the first time. Well, questioned answered. "For me", there will be no fish. My heart is no longer in it. FYI...some disturbing stuff on there as well as on govegan.com.

[VeganVixen]

Wow! Did I learn a lot from this thread. You guys are full of such good information. You should be proud! :p However, I just visited the PETA website for the first time. Well, questioned answered. "For me", there will be no fish. My heart is no longer in it. FYI...some disturbing stuff on there as well as on govegan.com.


thats what changed my mind about fish -but I dont like it when others feel the need to make someone feel guilty for eating fish ,or dairy or eggs ,ect .....sometimes we think that one person is the ONLY one doing it.....

[Alissa]

Great thread, just have to say i never use maple syrup as it is always cooked to death at very high temperatures. I do use other things that others may not want to use, miso, nama shoyu, etc.. but i do not have any maple syrup in my recipes and actually think it is not a good thing to eat but actually detrimental to health in a lot of ways.
Best,
Alissa

[RawTruth]

I agree that it is very easy to get our self involved in other people's business when it's really only ourselves that we should be concerned about.

When people who are interested in crossing over to the "other side" (LOL) ask me about it, though, I do say that 100% is the best way. Yes, I do say that it's worked *for me* as Christa suggested. But, also, I feel that it is okay that I talk about the difference that 100% makes. Yes, I personally have only my own experience to come from, but, how can I ignore the many, many other people (thousands?) who have benefited from raw through Alissa's work and Victoria's work and others. Alissa herself says that, among her clients, the ones who are 100% are the ones whose lives/health are radically altered, improved, and transformed. (I paraphrased you, Alissa, so please correct me if I misinterpreted.)

Because I haven't had the experience of coaching people doesn't mean to me that I shouldn't mention the incredible success that people who've gone 100% have experienced in their lives (yes, 100% might be a label, but there are times when labels are not bad things -- they're simply descriptive). Bear in mind, please, that I'm talking about interested people; I'm not jumping on and judging innocent bystanders!

I think the Nama Shoyu/miso/cashew issue is really a nonissue. I use these less and less the longer I'm raw. And, when I do, I don't feel bad. I eat them in such small amounts and so infrequently that they can't possibly constitute 1% anyway. And ... as has been said over and over in our wonderful forum here: compared to eating (cheetos/hot fudge sundae/cheeseburger/prime rib/sushi/or even salmon!), this is nothing!

[sara]

thats what changed my mind about fish -but I dont like it when others feel the need to make someone feel guilty for eating fish ,or dairy or eggs ,ect .....sometimes we think that one person is the ONLY one doing it.....

Point well taken. It wasn't the guilt that motivated me as much as just the thought of consuming something that had "passed" in such a painful way. That just can't be good for you, ya know? Anyway it confirmed what I was already feeling was right for my body. And from now on the only meat my family will eat will be kosher. But I definitely agree with you about making others feel guilty. My oldest daughter actually found the website and insists that we show it to our extended family to persuade them to make the same choice. I don't agree. If they ever bring up questions, maybe. I'm like Rawkinlocs, I don't really discuss this diet with everyone. When offered something, I just say "no thank you". Or that I just feel like a salad. I'm waiting for them to see the changes and ask me what I'm doing different.

[sara]

Great thread, just have to say i never use maple syrup as it is always cooked to death at very high temperatures. I do use other things that others may not want to use, miso, nama shoyu, etc.. but i do not have any maple syrup in my recipes and actually think it is not a good thing to eat but actually detrimental to health in a lot of ways.
Best,
Alissa

Sorry Alissa,
I should have been more specific. Julianno uses maple syrup. I actually use it a lot, perhaps I shouldn't.

[VeganVixen]

huh! he wont use dates ,carrots ,bannanas (he used too, not now) and uses maple syrup.....thats sorta a hit-and-miss.