vegan supplement for strong bones

[alicemagooey]

Hi Folks, Styersky posted a great thread about how we can help defend ourselves against osteoporosis.
http://www.rawfoodtalk.com/showthread.php?t=31024

i think that when we go RAW vegan, it will really do the job, and keep our bones strong and healthy.. especially if we persevere over the years with the diet, eating LOTS of greens and green smoothies.. I mean LOTS..

I mentioned a vegan calcium supplement which i am taking, and also a friend of mine.is taking it .it is called
ORTHO BONE VEGAN..
it seems to have a good bunch of things in it which are apparently good for bone health.

I mentioned this product in the above thread.. It is made in Canada.
There used to be a US distributor of the product but he stopped carrying it.

( by the way,the company makes two products.:
ortho bone vegan and
plain ortho bone regular

The man who was carrying it stopped doing so because he said he did not have the demand for the product.
But if enough people on this board wanted it and e mailed him, he may begin selling it again.

I wanted to know how much interest there might be in this by forum members..may i ask you to respond to this thread with a simple:
i would be interested in getting some.

It is somewhat expensive, but the bottle is large.(it costs about $20.00)
i am not one of these people who do mega doses of vitamins or minerals.
This is one of the few things i take actually..
but i feel it is a little bit of added bone insurance until i can get really established on raw vegan for a year or so..
(i am only a few months along )

best wishes,and appreciate any positive input anyone might have.
If there are enough people giving a postive response, i will foreward the whole thread link to the man who used to make the product available in the USA.

PS i do not have time at the moment to give a 'run down' on the ingredients, but they can be gotten from the website i believe.
which is ..http://www.AOR.ca

here is the run down of the product from the above website..remember, there are two products..one is non vegan

here is the vegan one
http://www.aor.ca/int/products/ortho_bone_vegan.php
alice

[Revvell]

You didn't ask for this yet, I have to say my feeling is, once a person stops ingesting dairy and other dead animal sources, which weakens the bones, AND starts doing weigh-bearing exercises, bone weakness will no longer be a problem.


Revvell

[hungrygirl]

http://www.rawfoodtalk.com/showthread.php?t=31068

[alicemagooey]

yes, thank you for the input..

as i mentioned in my post
i think that when we go RAW vegan, it will really do the job, and keep our bones strong and healthy.. especially if we persevere over the years with the diet, eating LOTS of greens and green smoothies.. I mean LOTS..

i totally agree with what your disagreement posts say, but ( and this is a big BUT ) , i
am coming to believe that this process of undoing all our past bad habits and giving the body new building blocks to work with to rebuild and restore takes TIME.

I have not had any dairy products for about 6 months, as has my friend who has been diagnosed with osteoporosis, but she just was tested and her bone density was worse..than when she was still eating dairy products.
She has been raw vegan for 6 months.

SO, as i mentioned in the posts which i have here as well as stys thread,
this is a TEMPORARY, but i think perhaps a NECESSARY stop gap measure.
and this may only go for people over 40.. i do not know..

I do not think people should ignore these things entirely, even tho the positive posts pro raw vegan have been posted.

but do what you want.

I know that i am going to do what is necessary, until i see positive results in my friend who is doing the raw vegan experiment with me..who is being tested, and in myself, who is not being tested..

thank you
alice

[Revvell]

I'm 58 and have never used any bottled vitamins/minerals... since, hmmm, about late '70's? IF I were to supplement, I'd do so with whole food herbs as opposed to pills. Alissa's got some green powder which I understand is good. It's concentrated so you'd be receiving more nutrients in a higher density.

I would also check out Norman Walker's books, especially about juicing.

Best way to ingest LOTS of greens as, I'm thinking you already know is ~ green smoothies. Add Alissa's green powder and I think you'd be good-to-go.

Can you tell I'm really not for isolated nutrients? :D

[alicemagooey]

Thank you for your kind response, Revell.
i guess you did not read the posts in the osteoporosis thread.
i wish you would read thoroughly before responding, because you are just speaking from your own experience. I am posting specifics here, not generalities.

I will give you the details.:
my friend is 73. She has been diagnosed with osteoporosis. She has been tested twice..She was on a cooked, vegetarian, (pure and as wholesome as possible ( no sugar, etc) for 30 years prior to being raw vegan. She was tested and bone density shown to have quite severe bone loss. She, like you, took no supplements.
She has been drinking raw vegetable juices according to Norman Walker for some 20 years. at least two glasses a day.
About four months ago, she became raw vegan.
She has continued with the juices, and has more than a quart daily of raw green smoothie.

She has been back to the doctor last week and tested again for bone density. She is worse. She has been taking some supplements irregularly since she became raw vegan, because she was diagnosed with osteoporosis, and wanted to try and help the situation.


Please do not continue to counter with your own experiences.
I am giving this specific experience because i am trying to address these circumstances and those similar.

I honestly believe that TEMPORARY supplementation would be of help.

many thanks
alice

[Revvell]

I honestly believe that TEMPORARY supplementation would be of help.


Well then, go for it.

I am responding in GENERAL as there are more people reading this and what is written here is available to everyone as it is an open forum no matter who writes the question.

Also, I see no mention of weight-bearing exercise (in your last post ~ although you may have mentioned it previously ~ and no, I don't have the time to read through a whole other thread ~ or even much of this one). IF you (or anyone) don't feel what I write is of use, ignore it. Someone else may find it/them very useful.

I am not countering ~ I am suggesting. Bone density depends on weigh-bearing movement as much as nutrition. Victoria Boutenko.. the queen of green smoothies even mentioned that their jaw bones got weak because they weren't being used.

Best to you,

Revvell

[SmilingRawDancer]

I'm kind of more in Revvel's camp....I do take some supplements when I feel like I need them. Iron and b12 - they make a HUGE difference, and I can tell when I'm getting deficient.

Occasionally I'll be sucked into taking a calcium citrate, but I don't take it every day religiously. I dehydrate collards and then grind them in my dry vitamix to a powder and refridgerate that, and add it to my smoothies.
3 bunches of collards (over a pound I'd assume) dehydrated into maybe 1/4 - 1/3 cup, so I get very concentrated calcium that way, plus I know whats in it and where it came from.

[alicemagooey]

wow..great idea about dehydrating the greens. !
Do not have a dehydrator..but great idea.

Revell,
Once again, i made this thread specific for a reason.
The osteoporosis thread i mentioned would perhaps be better for more general information..

Too bad you do not read the other threads, but that is your choice.
It might help, in some circumstances.to help you to get a better idea as to how you might respond to a question, whether readership is general or specific.

My friend does weight bearing excercise..daily, for about 30-40 minutes and has done so for more than a few years.That has been covered also.

if that helps.

Still wondering if anyone else is older and has tried most every other suggestion (I have done a great deal of reading at this forum and elsewhere, and try my doggondest not to waste other peoples time asking things which i could find elsewhere on my own.)

Once again, the purpose of this thread is to see if there might be any interest by people who might want to temporarily supplement their raw vegan diet until they can build up strength and bone mass by diet alone.

i imagine the original intent of the post has been lost by now.

thanks again for your time.
i do understand that you did take time to respond..even if you did not know exactly to what questions/information you were responding.
thank you for what you DID DO pertaining to the question.

cheerio
alice

[styersky]

Even though I live in the boonies in Ky, a town of about 5,000, yesterday I learned of a nutrition oriented doctor and will make contact with him tomorrow to see what he says about osteoporosis and fosomax, and hopefully recommend a supplement for osteoporosis rather than fosomax.

I walk 2 to 3 miles about 5 days a week. Try to do what is right for the bones but look forward to a professional medical opinion about supplements.

Thanks, Alice, for your concern for those of us that are doing all we know and want to do anything else that is medically sound for osteoporosis.

[luckitri]

Styersky, I personally have seen that sometimes doctors in small towns provide their patients with more state of the art contemporary care than the big city ones. Especially because in a small town - everybody is watching. I also have seen small town libraries with outrageously phenomenal book collections. Just trying to be hopeful.

[the_lab_rat]

Alice, thank you for posting this! I really appreciate the info!

I'm only in my 20's, but am still concerned about osteoporosis. I think our family has a lot of the risk factors, so I'm trying to start now to reverse any damage done and prevent getting it later. I think you're right that some people may need supplements in addition to a raw vegan diet, especially when just starting out or to begin correcting problems that already exist. I'm fortunate enough to live in an area in CA where supplements like the one you mentioned are pretty easy to find, so I don't think I'd want to order one online, but it was definitely helpful to look at all the ingredients to compare. That does look like a good one. Thanks again for the info and for your concern :)

[Raw Angel Mom]

I recommend that you watch a diet for all reason. This is a very informative and well made dvd. The author is a MD. He was raised on a dairy farm, one night before he was supposed to perform a surgery on one of his patient, he did the blood analysis himself. To his surprise there was some fat floating on the blood instead of the clear liquid.

After this, he pursued more research to find out that any animal product is toxic to a human being. First the fat isn't liquid at our body temperature, which cause enormous stress to our liver to clear out after we eat any animal flesh, or fish, or eggs, or dairy. Second, the human average only need about 30 gram of protein. If you eat a typical diet such one egg coffee, toast in the morning, a burger at lunch and a home meal with meat at night, you will have 150 gram of protein. In order, to clear this excess of protein our body need to use CALCIUM. Yeap, calcium and if none in your system, it will take it from your bones, which lead to the bone decease, etc.... So if you take dairy to prevent osteoporosis, you ironically will put this worst. In North America, we are the one that consume the most dairy and with also the higher rate of osteoporosis deceased. A diet for all reason DVD, you will find many valuable information and it will keep you vegan.

By the way, the calcium that we take goes in our muscle this is the magnesium that our body needs to make calcium for our bone.

[styersky]

Sounds like a great dvd. Can you give me more info like where I get the dvd, etc. The exact title and author, etc . THANKS!

[Raw Angel Mom]

Here is his website

http://drklaper.com/

To buy this DVD Google "A diet for all reason" You will see different places selling it

Dr. Klaper offer phone session, you can pay by paypal. You can have all the question answer that you have for you. He also have some asked and answered question that you can read. This is very interesting.

I suffered from anemia for most of my life. I was worry too to become a vegetarian at first. I was taking supplement etc... It went better at some point, but then i discover that you needed to eat greens etc... broccolis did the trick for me and spinach. Now being on a raw VEGAN diet, I have my iron back to normal. I take greens everyday. Sometime i juice them some other day i make smoothies with them.

Here are some recipe

Spinach and peaches

2 hand full of spinach(i use a entire pack of spinach)
2 cup of water
6 peaches

Just blend everything throughly (i got a vitamix, so it get creamy)

Kale lemonade

Juice a bunch of kayle
Juice 5 medium apple
Juice one whole lemon

Boston Salad and pear

1 bounch of boston Salad
2 cup of water
4 pears


You can mix any greens (wheat grass, dandelion, greens of vegetables, salad, spinach, kale, chard, etc...) with any fruits and it taste so good

If you don't have a juicer. Buy a nylon bag. For the kale recipe, you may have to split it in half to fit, and do this twice. Add enough water to blend, then juice your mixture within you nylon bag, and here you go, you got your greens.

IRON IS BEST FOUND IN GREENS. This is a myth that the best iron is found in the meat.

Some greens such sea weed has B12 even. Bee pollen has all the main nutriments including B12, iron, calcium, etc...

You can also purchase e3live which contain all the nutriments and is sold frozen to preserve the enzyme.

[styersky]

RawAngelMom . . . thank you so much. I am going to repeat the website:

http://drklaper.com

EVERYONE . . . if you are concerned about osteoporosis, or a great many ailments, please go here to this website. Wonderful information.

Thank you so much RawAngelMom.

[DoctorKlaper]

Here is his website

http://drklaper.com/



Raw Angel Mom -

The domain name has changed. The official web site for Dr. Michael Klaper is: DoctorKlaper.com

An article written by Dr. Michael Klaper about osteoporosis is at:

http://doctorKlaper.com/answers05.html

Thank you.

[Revvell]

The best thing I've found for strong bones is weight-bearing movement. Of course nutrition is important yet, people think just taking in the right nutrients is enough. It's not. Our jawbones need pressure; all our bones need pressure to become and stay strong and flexible. Walking is good for the lower body. What are you doing for the upper?

[Raw Angel Mom]

Agreed with the weight lifting. It increases the density of the bone.

Thank you for the new info on dr. Klaper.

[MysticTree]

Check this wonderful woman out.

http://www.hooping.org/2010/11/does-hula-hooping-cure-osteoporosis/

[RawDad]

My mother has osteoperosis, takes huge calcium supplements, and consumes a lot of dairy. What she doesn't do is get exersize. Revell is simply saying what works.

"To keep your bones healthy and to prevent osteoporosis, the most important thing you can do is to stay as physically active as you can throughout your life. Since calcium is always being laid down in the skeleton, it is never to late to begin to strengthen the bones." from the website linked above.

The documentary Eating (http://www.amazon.com/Eating-3rd-Mike-Anderson/dp/B001CRQ8K6/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1327888073&sr=8-1) also states that the only way to strengthen bones is to work them. They are very similar to muscles.

[Revvell]

Agreed with the weight lifting.

Didn't say weight-lifting.. said weight-bearing which may include the lifting of heavy objects ~ your own body for one.

[Raw Angel Mom]

I did read your post properly. Weight lifting or weight bearing, doesn't matter to the body. Challenging our body with physical strength, increases our bone density. If you think about it, it makes perfect sense. Also, if your observe the hand of workers which their work requires managing heavy weight (construction, farmers, lumberjack etc....), they have strong hand. It isn't only DNA.

Someone that has carried extra weight on them, once they loses the weight, will have typically a strong bone structure. Of course, the bone structure takes a toll with abuse of animal protein and acidocist.