E.coli outbreak from BAGGED SPINACH...

[LisaDS88]

I found this article earlier today. It seems kinda weird to link spinach to such a problem, but I guess it's worth the extra caution. (also considering that I eat bagged spinach frequently!)


http://www.cnn.com/2006/HEALTH/09/14/tainted.spinach.ap/index.html

[Sharon in Colorado]

FDA officials do not know the source of the outbreak other than it appears to be linked to bagged spinach. "We're advising people not to eat it," Acheson said.

Now why can't they advise people not to eat all the other crap that kills them or makes them very sick?

[Veganforlife]

Now why can't they advise people not to eat all the other crap that kills them or makes them very sick?

So true! It seems like veggies get picked on all the time. Not once do you hear or see written anywhere that folks better not eat the roadkill-fed, old (4 years) milk cows that McCraps slaughters and grinds into their barf burgers!

I personally do not trust bagged products. To me they taste like plastic... :eek:

[michigan roman]

same here on the bagged products .

much more land has to be put into use for growing human plant food , as opposed to animal ranching on it , so that theres a constant turnover of produce in city markets so were not eating the 10 day old stuff .

im sorry to tell ya but the jobs on us to get pissed off about it and start kicking some fat pigs out of washington dc and hollywood in order to take control of our food options which are of major / base importance to our and our childrens health !!!

im so sick of seeing that stupid burger king king jackass and mcdonald commercials and donut ads etc that i could rip that burger king idiots head off .

lets start a movement demanding land be turned over to people who want to plant farm it in order to supply the country with enough fresh raw plants before we go extinct of cancer !!!

you fat pigs in dc and "west dc" aka hollywood better be sleeping lightly because your job security is zero . im sick of your ineptness , and im really sick of you stupid a$$es turning all our kids into fat pigs via your damn tv commercials . I WANT RAW FOODIST HAVING A CONSTANT VOICE AND PLACE ON THAT DAMN TV !!!

the time is nearing for me to get my game face on , im sick of being dictated to by lost idiots !!!

[musicalfruit]

So, will washing them in vegie wash help or no?

[berrymarymac]

I was just about to post this! I just threw away my spinach and will be buying fresh, non bagged for now on even though it is such a hassle!

[Veganforlife]

michigan roman! Well said my friend! We need folks like YOU in DC! I could go on and rant and rave about how upsetting this is to me, but I feel not too many would listen. I've said my piece to many a folk however.
Have you read Fast Food Nation by Eric Schlosser? Excellent book! Opened my eyes up - big time. It's everything I had questioned - Eric researched it and made it real! Unbelievable!
The school systems' so-called food programs are a joke too.
I'm w/you anytime you wanna go get that Burger Barf's head! On the way, we should definitely get McShit's and have it on a post as we parade our way through town!!!
I have always hated McPuke's. They were the leader of this food cancer.
:(
I'd start a movement in a heartbeat! I say let's do it!
NOW - before it's too late!!!

[Spectatrix]

Now why can't they advise people not to eat all the other crap that kills them or makes them very sick?
Because a lot of it is subjective or subject to much debate, whereas nobody is going to argue that e. coli *doesn't* make you sick. In any case, even that specific article mentions fast food:

In 1993, a major E. coli outbreak sickened about 700 people and killed four who ate undercooked Jack in the Box hamburgers in Washington state. That outbreak led to tighter Agriculture Department safety standards for meat and poultry producers.

[michigan roman]

lets think up some raw foodist ads we want on tv , to help kids / everyone start to eat how we think correct instead of how the cattle ranchers think correct .

heres one = hi im sharon in colorado , i fuel my cells existance with nothing but raw plant matter and water . and by the way , burger king twerp - your very lame !!!

another one = hi earthlings im arky , i enjoy studying nutrition and disease . my studies have led me to become a raw food vegan . and by the way , white castle hamburger company - i have a craving to demolish everyone of your buildings on this planet !!!

[Veganforlife]

m r - you may be on to something here. Seriously! Shoot, the ingredients of the raw foods would be something that everyone could recognize and pronounce, which is something the fast food jokers can't claim.
Hmmmm, you've got me thinking here! :)
But it's late here on the east coast and my brain isn't as sharp as it will be tomorrow. I KNOW I can come up with something then...

[Sharon in Colorado]

I'm sure there's a valid reason why the Burger King's head is so oversized.

[Veganforlife]

HAHAHA!!!!
'Ya think?

[juliebove]

I just saw that on the news. I started buying bagged salads when they first came out with them, but I don't any more unless there is no other option. And in that case, I make sure to wash it well before I eat it. I do buy those heads of Romaine that come three to a bag, but I always wash them.

My husband drives me nuts because he doesn't think it's necessary to wash produce before eating it. Not that he eats a lot of produce mind you, but one day it will catch up with him!

[michigan roman]

michigan roman! Well said my friend! We need folks like YOU in DC! I could go on and rant and rave about how upsetting this is to me, but I feel not too many would listen. I've said my piece to many a folk however.
Have you read Fast Food Nation by Eric Schlosser? Excellent book! Opened my eyes up - big time. It's everything I had questioned - Eric researched it and made it real! Unbelievable!
The school systems' so-called food programs are a joke too.
I'm w/you anytime you wanna go get that Burger Barf's head! On the way, we should definitely get McShit's and have it on a post as we parade our way through town!!!
I have always hated McPuke's. They were the leader of this food cancer.
:(
I'd start a movement in a heartbeat! I say let's do it!
NOW - before it's too late!!!
thanx for the comp vfl . im digging in everyday in attempt to amass the self fire power i want to weild so as to clash with the elite society and come out victorious .

for now its slow going for me , but hopefully during this slow time we can pool ideas in effort to bring momentum to our movement / our beliefs .

nice to know your out there

[luckitri]

LisaDS88 - thank you for posting this because I listen to the radio all day at work and I did not hear this at all. One of my local stores was having an incredible sale on spinach - glad I came here before going back to get it. They also had an incredible sale on Dole during and after the last outbreak. I found it interesting that the article does not mention that ecoli is also found in human feces and is known to be on produce that is imported from countries that do not have our restrictions against fertilizing with human waste. They do not want to add to the people against NAFTA and CAFTA but many people have warned of this since the beginning.

[misslinda]

im so sick of seeing that stupid burger king king jackass and mcdonald commercials and donut ads etc that i could rip that burger king idiots head off .

lets start a movement demanding land be turned over to people who want to plant farm it in order to supply the country with enough fresh raw plants before we go extinct of cancer !!!

you fat pigs in dc and "west dc" aka hollywood better be sleeping lightly because your job security is zero . im sick of your ineptness , and im really sick of you stupid a$$es turning all our kids into fat pigs via your damn tv commercials . I WANT RAW FOODIST HAVING A CONSTANT VOICE AND PLACE ON THAT DAMN TV !!!

the time is nearing for me to get my game face on , im sick of being dictated to by lost idiots !!!


WHoahhhhhhhh, MichiganRoman for president. Let me know when you need a signature for this petitition!!!!!!!!! How are those tomatoe plants doing btw? :D

[michigan roman]

hi ml , politics aside for now cuz im too far past bedtime .
but on tomatos ,
well sorry to report my crop was off this year , too busy to mulch and water plants sufficiently , and not enough rain here in my area for them to go without help .

nice of you to drop by my post and announce your alliance .
hope we can rap soon , take care

[Tirza]

:eek: Eeeeeeek!! :eek: I was just at a wedding tonight and guess what they served for salad! SPINACH! I was thrilled that there was a salad I actually found appetizing! It was really great - spinach, pine nuts, little wedges of plums! And a delicately tangy fresh dressing.

This wedding was the "last word" in elegance - probably 600+ people - incredible decor! But no matter how fancy, I would wonder, with that many people being served, HOW could they be very careful with the washing of salad greens? I am guessing that it came right out of the bags!

Now I am going right to my kitchen to prepare a drink with Apple Cider Vinegar in warm water - JUST IN CASE!

I also use bagged spinach every day for my green smoothies, but I ALWAYS wash it anyway as it always seems to have grit in if I don't. I better wash with something soapy.

Suggestions??

[Pierre]

Is E. coli as dangerous to people who eat raw as it is to people who eat cooked? We don't have the same population of gut bacteria.

[dreamrawalwz]

I used to buy bagged organic spinach, but now I get it and it goes bad basically in one day! :eek:

I'm not having greens lately, but if I do it's just hearts of romaine. My question is are the bagged hearts (not pre-cut) of romaine bad? They're bagged, but....??

[rawfigure]

Reading the article I do not see a conspiracy against Raw food, they are simply sighting an incident where e coli got into bagged spinach. It was an isolated case but they still warn...so wash you spinach in veggie wash.

It is most likely a case of miss handling where the spinach came into contact with the e coli...and contaminated a batch. Its probably similar to making a salad and contaminating it with salmonella from miss handling raw chicken in the same kitchen.

We need to not think the world is against Raw eating. Many say eating raw foods is important part of the diet.

and we here get down on SAD as much as they get down on Raw..or more !!

[Amberly]

Geez.....I saw this on GMA as I was sucking on a spinach smoothie. :(

[Rawma]

Boy,you guys jump down non-raw throats the minute you can. Cut the FDA a break in this case. They are warning you not to eat any bagged spinach because there have been several breakouts across the states of e-coli and one death! That's it...no conspiracy to get us not to eat our veggies just not bagged spinach. After you come down off of your soap-box, buy yourself some un-bagged spinach and eat to your hearts content.
Stay positive people and lead by example! :)
Lisa
Living on Live Food Teacher

[Veganforlife]

Boy,you guys jump down non-raw throats the minute you can. Cut the FDA a break in this case. They are warning you not to eat any bagged spinach because there have been several breakouts across the states of e-coli and one death! That's it...no conspiracy to get us not to eat our veggies just not bagged spinach. After you come down off of your soap-box, buy yourself some un-bagged spinach and eat to your hearts content.
Stay positive people and lead by example! :)
Lisa
Living on Live Food Teacher

The FDA??? You've got to be sh**ting me! I don't trust them as far as I can spit!!! And it's not a case of jumping down non-raw throats. It's just that the media, the FDA, the USDA, they are all lying SOBs!!! Sorry, that's just how I feel.
I am a very positive person. I positively believe that one day these fast food geeks will get what's coming to them!

[Rawma]

Who said anything about trusting the FDA...I just said they don't want us to eat bagged spinach so we don't get e-coli and possibly die...that's it!
Lisa

[Boysenberry]

Shouldn't that CNN article be saying that e-coli is caused from "unwashed" produce instead of "raw"??? Isn't that closer to the truth, since the virus is in cattle intestines and feces? Another way the media scares people from the truth.

[pinkglttr]

The only link they have made so far is that the spinach was from bags that have made people sick. A child died. DO NOT try to "wash" your veggies and use home remedies to get around this. E Coli is very serious. Just throw out your spinach until you know what is going on.

[Dimond]

There is no mention of this being about organic spinach as well. Most likely they're talking about conventional.

It's very hard to even find regular spinach. On the health/raw experts say baby spinach is better for you.

[pinkglttr]

Just wanted to add this as I was reading it


"But produce need be contaminated with only a small amount of E. coli for a person to fall ill. The E. coli O157:H7 strain, which lives in the intestines of healthy cattle and is present in manure, is passed to humans when they ingest the bacteria.

How E. coli is contaminating fresh produce is a mystery to health officials. Some hypotheses include tainted dust blowing over fields, birds eating tainted cattle droppings and then contaminating fields with their own tainted droppings, contaminated floodwater, and workers carrying the bacteria on their hands or clothes.

In the 1990s, the O157:H7 strain was associated with undercooked hamburger meat served at Jack in the Box restaurants, which sickened hundreds, and unpasteurized Odwalla apple juice, which killed a baby girl and sickened more than 60 others.

In the 1996 Odwalla outbreak, sales plummeted and the company paid a $1.5-million fine after pleading guilty to 16 misdemeanor criminal charges."

[Trish1948]

If you buy loose spinach, all should be OK? Could you use the vegetable clearner they sell?

[Boysenberry]

I can't see any answers to whether or not we can eat it unbagged, like bulk? or organic. Seems best to buy it in a "head" form for awhile. There are many questions and very few answers. Guess we just need to take percautions for a while. :)

[Sharon in Colorado]

Reading the article I do not see a conspiracy against Raw food, they are simply sighting an incident where e coli got into bagged spinach. It was an isolated case but they still warn...so wash you spinach in veggie wash.

It is most likely a case of miss handling where the spinach came into contact with the e coli...and contaminated a batch. Its probably similar to making a salad and contaminating it with salmonella from miss handling raw chicken in the same kitchen.

We need to not think the world is against Raw eating. Many say eating raw foods is important part of the diet.

and we here get down on SAD as much as they get down on Raw..or more !!


Good point, Raw Figure.

[lissomllama]

Actually the big problem here (other than people getting E-coli) is that now people are even more afraid to eat raw produce. At the end of all these news articles it usually is telling people to thoroughly cook all their produce and not buy things raw. More people tend to listen to the head honchos and FDA than to actual reason. So now we have yet another group of people saying that raw is 'dangerous'. The government and supermarkets have already begun dipping foods in hot water baths so now it is just a matter of time before all of our leafy greens are pre-boiled or sprayed with junk as well just so that that everyone in the food industry can cover their behinds.

I'm really upset about this because as it stands I can't grow my own food until we have a house with a yard and I buy mixed organic greens to make my green smoothies and they contain some spinach. I NEED my greens and now I'm afraid to buy/eat them because I don't want to get E-coli. I'm concerned with all the negative publicity raw produce is going to get because of this. I wish that they would find the source already, this is taking them forever. This case is about a month old now and they still haven't figured it out.

Why couldn't this have happened with some other food like meat or milk or something that is actually bad for one's health??? This is ridiculous.

[cattail]

This must be why I've been unable to get to the store to buy some spinach this week (I've been trying to find time all week as it's what I'm craving). God protecting me! Woot!

Meanwhile, I can't help but wonder... are the grocers tearing open bags and putting it in their display bowls / salad bars so it's not bagged anymore? I suspect this means I'm going to have to set up my hydroponics garden again and grow my own spinach.

[Veganforlife]

Remember when THIS came out?

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12536902/

[MagicalDaze]

My experience yesterday: I have been eating massive amounts of greens lately, primarily fresh bundled spinach - but the past several days the spinach has included mainly larger, tougher leaves. So after choosing 2 of those bunches & being dismayed at the size of the leaves, I also grabbed a big 9 oz. BAG of spinach (which I very rarely buy). When I went to make my afternoon salad I thought hey - why not save these bundles for mainly green smoothies & take the easy way out, just dumping this bag of already cleaned, nice small leaves into a bowl for instant salad!

I made a nice dressing & enjoyed a huge salad, using 2/3 of the bag of spinach. Then, still wanting more greens I went back into the kitchen to make another salad, intending to finish off the bag. Just then the report came over the news (which I rarely ever watch!): "blah, blah, e. coli, fresh packaged spinach... so if U have any fresh, packaged spinach in your frig, DON'T EAT IT!"

NOW U tell me!?!? Now that I have at least 6 oz of the stuff sitting in my stomach! Geez - between that & the reports of chemicals being used in all of the packaged greens, incl. organic - I think I am giving up any packaged greens entirely! I'll stick to the larger, tougher, more labor intensive FRESH leafies, thank U!

[Queen Shelley]

More unhealthy people getting sicker, then Big Brother will have to come in and make it worse! So, if you have a healthy body, these critters won't bother you. They did it with alfalfa sprouts too. Ohh, scare people. Or Jack in the Box burgers too. Healthy bowel=healthy body=bugs won't get to you....but, if they do I turn to my Dr. Schulze 'poop medicine' guaranteed to stop any diarreah causing bugs. I keep a little jar in the car too.

If you feel badly, let your body barf and poop it out for awhile. When you know you're empty. :eek: Mix the black powder in some water and drink it down. It will heal the bowel, 'scoop up the bad stuff' (that's technical talk) and eliminate it without any more pain. Charcoal is the black part, flax, apple pectin, bentonite, psyllium, slipperyelm, marchmallowroot, fennel, peppermint. Called Intestinal Formula #2 Good for those trips to Mexico or other places where you might get the 'Two Step'! :D

[rawfigure]

This must be why I've been unable to get to the store to buy some spinach this week (I've been trying to find time all week as it's what I'm craving). God protecting me! Woot!

Meanwhile, I can't help but wonder... are the grocers tearing open bags and putting it in their display bowls / salad bars so it's not bagged anymore? I suspect this means I'm going to have to set up my hydroponics garden again and grow my own spinach.

My husband and I ate 2 bags of spinach in last few days...no worry.. but it is something to be concerned about. So for now if I have spinach it will have to be cooked....or not at all.

[Oceana]

What about just washing it?

[dreamrawalwz]

My mom called Earthboud Farms about our bagged spinach we have just to be safe. They said they heard of what was going on in the news and assures us that they do all the precautions and safety stuff they need to, including prewashing 2x I believe. They're sending us a complementary bag now to replace the one we currently have if we don't feel comfortable consuming it.

[codajess]

Yeah. That's not a "more reason to go raw." The spinach IS raw. That's more reason to go cooked. :(

[dreamrawalwz]

Actually the big problem here (other than people getting E-coli) is that now people are even more afraid to eat raw produce. At the end of all these news articles it usually is telling people to thoroughly cook all their produce and not buy things raw. More people tend to listen to the head honchos and FDA than to actual reason. So now we have yet another group of people saying that raw is 'dangerous'. The government and supermarkets have already begun dipping foods in hot water baths so now it is just a matter of time before all of our leafy greens are pre-boiled or sprayed with junk as well just so that that everyone in the food industry can cover their behinds.

I'm really upset about this because as it stands I can't grow my own food until we have a house with a yard and I buy mixed organic greens to make my green smoothies and they contain some spinach. I NEED my greens and now I'm afraid to buy/eat them because I don't want to get E-coli. I'm concerned with all the negative publicity raw produce is going to get because of this. I wish that they would find the source already, this is taking them forever. This case is about a month old now and they still haven't figured it out.

Why couldn't this have happened with some other food like meat or milk or something that is actually bad for one's health??? This is ridiculous.

Stuff DOES happen like this much more with things that are bad for one's health, but either 1) it isn't reported, 2)it's not as much hype when it IS reported, or 3) people don't care and would rather eat this stuff still...

Oh, but EArthbound Farms Organic Baby Spinach in bags. My mom called (i posted on the other E. coli thread). THey're safe.

[Sharon in Colorado]

I am pretty sure that most people who don't have immune challenges will be fine even eating the bad spinach. Washing it may not get rid of stuff on the surface completely, unless you plan on submerging it in water with some sort of cleaner in there or vinegar, or a drop of bleach as some do.

We usually use the Earthbound Farms as well, and most of the time in our smoothies, never had anyone get sick.

I just believe if your body is clean enough it is going to be resistant to viruses and bacteria.

[rawfigure]

I am pretty sure that most people who don't have immune challenges will be fine even eating the bad spinach. Washing it may not get rid of stuff on the surface completely, unless you plan on submerging it in water with some sort of cleaner in there or vinegar, or a drop of bleach as some do.

We usually use the Earthbound Farms as well, and most of the time in our smoothies, never had anyone get sick.

I just believe if your body is clean enough it is going to be resistant to viruses and bacteria.

I put my greens in the sink with veggie wash, rinse, then wrap in a clean towel for a few min to dry. I will continue to do that...bottle says wash most bacteria.

[rawfigure]

Why couldn't this have happened with some other food like meat or milk or something that is actually bad for one's health??? This is ridiculous.


It has happened countless times with meat. More often than with a veggie. So this too will pass and not damage the reputation of Spinach.

Look at the Deaths from Raw Burger...and look at how many still eat it ??

A great book about this topic is John Robbins new book..Food Revolution...my DH hates it when I read to him from it about the meat industry. I show him picture, tell him about a factory farm and he says lets go eat..I feel like a Steak... :mad: :mad:

[GreenPrince]

Don't be afraid of bacteria! They are our friends and are an important part of the creation.
All of them have a positive task to fullfill; to brake down everything no longer viably,
to maintain the biological cycle. Imagine what would happen if the autumn leaves of the tree's
fell to the ground and never broked down to soil.

There is something crazy with this civilisation, when we think that bacteria is something
destructive, which we have to fight. There are no dangerous bacteria, only dangerious way
of living. A healthy person cannot be sick by bacteria. You have to first weaken your
immune system for a long time. And then get plentum of bacteria at once.

During my summer holidays in my late teens, I worked in a dairy laboratory and was
in charge for the bacteriological analysis of the milk products.

I found e.coli in all (pasteurized) milk we sold. I had colonies of millions of them in
petri dishes on my lab table, where I ate my veggi lunch.
E.coli? Oh, I love them, they are so beautiful...

The risk to dye of NOT eating spinach and greens is maybe 5 millions times higher than the
risk to dye of e.coli by infected green food. That's is 5'000'000:1. Which risk do you prefer?

Go on eating green food. Wash, eat and be happy!

[pinkglttr]

I don't know about what all of you think, but you cannot just wash this SPECIFIC STRAIN of Ecoli out. YES, there are good bacteria, but this STRAIN IS BAD, BAD, BAD. EVEN IF you do not DIE from it (from a weakened immune system) you will most likely get diarrhea and other problems as your body fights it.

Why put yourself through that????

I don't understand why we can't just hold off on eating spinach for a while. There ARE other green things in the world to eat.

[Freesia]

Who said anything about trusting the FDA...I just said they don't want us to eat bagged spinach so we don't get e-coli and possibly die...that's it!
Lisa

The facts are simple. It possible is contaminated. It has nothing to do with picking on spinach and not other foods. I see warnings about those also. Fruits and veggies can become contaminated with fecal waste from animals or humans. Just think where some of the produce is grown. I have Mexican friends that tell me about the fields and poor drainage and run off of human and animal feces into the fields. That is what I hear. Haven't done the research on my own but I have also heard it time and time again that veggies can be contaminated just as much as animal products because of the conditions where it is grown.

I hear more about animal products being contaminated in the press than veggies though. Packaged lunch meats also. The thing is we won't be cooking a lot of the veggies so it is a serious matter. Meat is cooked so who knows how much of the bacteria has not been detected. Warnings to not cross contaminate, wash and cook meat thoroughly is because the risk is high with meat.

[Freesia]

I don't know about what all of you think, but you cannot just wash this SPECIFIC STRAIN of Ecoli out. YES, there are good bacteria, but this STRAIN IS BAD, BAD, BAD. EVEN IF you do not DIE from it (from a weakened immune system) you will most likely get diarrhea and other problems as your body fights it.

Why put yourself through that????

I don't understand why we can't just hold off on eating spinach for a while. There ARE other green things in the world to eat.

Please listen to this advice because it can be very serious. I know of a child that almost died from this a few years ago. She was in ICU for so long and has permanent damage to her kidneys and liver.

[Freesia]

Don't be afraid of bacteria! They are our friends and are an important part of the creation.
All of them have a positive task to fullfill; to brake down everything no longer viably,
to maintain the biological cycle. Imagine what would happen if the autumn leaves of the tree's
fell to the ground and never broked down to soil.

There is something crazy with this civilisation, when we think that bacteria is something
destructive, which we have to fight. There are no dangerous bacteria, only dangerious way
of living. A healthy person cannot be sick by bacteria. You have to first weaken your
immune system for a long time. And then get plentum of bacteria at once.

During my summer holidays in my late teens, I worked in a dairy laboratory and was
in charge for the bacteriological analysis of the milk products.

I found e.coli in all (pasteurized) milk we sold. I had colonies of millions of them in
petri dishes on my lab table, where I ate my veggi lunch.
E.coli? Oh, I love them, they are so beautiful...

The risk to dye of NOT eating spenat and greens is maybe 5 millions times higher than the
risk to dye of e.coli by infected green food. That's is 5'000'000:1. Which risk do you prefer?

Go on eating green food. Wash, eat and be happy!

Please forgive me for saying this but that is a very ignorate statement. This is a deadly bateria. You have got to be kidding. Washing won't kill this. It can kill you though.

[Sharon in Colorado]

I just saw another report on the spinach issue. They were saying that if infected water was used, then somehow the bacteria is inside the cells.

I dunno. I just have a small organic bag of it in the refrigerator, but I won't use it as my kids are not 100% raw. They apprantly have a nationwide pulling of all bags, so I will contact Earthbound.

ETA: http://www.ebfarm.com/press/foodsafe/


A statement from Samantha Cabaluna of Earthbound Farm


SAN JUAN BAUTISTA, CALIF.; September 15, 2006: We are aware that there are reports of some illnesses in several states and one death, possibly related to e coli in spinach. Along with others in the produce industry, we are currently working with federal and state authorities to assist them in their investigation to identify the source of the bacteria, providing them unfettered access to our facilities and product for testing and investigation. We will do whatever is necessary to help protect the health and safety of the public.

In view of this situation, the US Food and Drug Administration (FDA) is currently recommending that consumers not eat bagged fresh spinach. As a result, we have temporarily stopped shipping spinach products, and have taken spinach out of our salads that contain them. Any consumers that have Earthbound Farm brand packaged spinach in their homes who choose to follow the FDA’s recommendations at this time may contact us at 800-690-3200 for a refund or replacement coupons.

Everyone at Earthbound Farm is terribly upset about these illnesses and death and their potential relationship to a product that is ordinarily a very healthy food choice. We are committed to producing exceptionally fresh and healthy produce. Quality and food safety continue to be our top priorities.


For more information, consumers may contact us at (800) 690-3200.

[Freesia]

I will always eat lots of raw greens but I won't buy bagged spinach for awhile. I always wash any produce that comes from the market. If it was grown local and sanitary conditions I will just rinse it.

[dreamrawalwz]

I havn't heard the news report so keep this in mind when I post my question. Now, from what I understand...are tehy talking about ALL Spinach because there are many distributors! If it's in one distributer from one farm then why are people so scared of all the other spinach? I don't understand, but I also havn't read the article as I said. I don't think it's possible for ALL spinach fields to be contaminated by e. coli at once...you just need to know which brand (like the Dole lettuce a few months ago) and avoid that!

[luckitri]

8 states so far and source undetermined as of yet. They say it won't wash off the spinach even with repeated washings - so toss it! Somehow it is in the spinach just like the salmonella was actually in the seeds of alfalfa sprouts. Political hot potato - they will have to tell us some source eventually. I am not a farmer so the legitimacy of what they say will not be determinable by me.

[berrymarymac]

Now 20 states are in the count! That's a LOT!! And it's just bagged spinach, not ones you find in the store and wash yourself. Simply the bagged.

[berrymarymac]

They just identified it!! http://www.cnn.com/2006/HEALTH/09/15/tainted.spinach.ap/index.html

"The Food and Drug Administration said late Friday that an E. coli outbreak had been linked to bagged spinach products distributed by Natural Selection Foods/Earthbound Farms, based in San Juan Bautista, California."

I buy that brand!! :eek: Thank god I threw it away!!!

[Goldsplinter]

Let me look at my bags.

My parents even told me about this spinach stuff...lol

[luckitri]

I see from the article that the company listed is merely a distributor - not the grower.

[dreamrawalwz]

They just identified it!! http://www.cnn.com/2006/HEALTH/09/15/tainted.spinach.ap/index.html

"The Food and Drug Administration said late Friday that an E. coli outbreak
had been linked to bagged spinach products distributed by Natural Selection Foods/Earthbound Farms, based in San Juan Bautista, California."

I buy that brand!! :eek: Thank god I threw it away!!!

Hmm k. My mom just destroyed the bag of spinach we have haha. Said we weren't going to try it or even put it in our compost now...

[LisaDS88]

Yikes!!!!!! I started this thread yesterday when I saw it on the news, and then ate a bag of MIXED GREENS this afternoon. Then I found out tonight it is Earthbound Farms brand spinach that is the problem. I looked at what I ate today and saw it was Earthbound Farms brand AND there is spinach in the mixed greens!! I'm scared!!! I'm in the middle of a detox right now anyway....on the 9th day 100% raw after several months of being way off track. I searched online for symptoms of E.coli.... I found it can take 2 to 4 days or even up to 8 days to show up.

I'm downing glasses of apple cider vinegar cocktails. Anyone know of any other super germ/virus/bacteria fighting things I can take just in case???

[pinkglttr]

I had meant to buy some spinach at the store earlier this week when I got all my produce, but I forgot. I guess someone was already looking out for me :)

[Sharon in Colorado]

I usually use that brand of spinach for our smoothies but lately haven't been, been making other morning drinks without spinach or using parsley. That is kind of interesting.

I also have the box of mixed baby greens containing spinach which I tossed.

If you call the number I posted above you can get a refund or replacement coupon.

I wonder if the tainted boxes are coded the same?

[Sharon in Colorado]

Yikes!!!!!! I started this thread yesterday when I saw it on the news, and then ate a bag of MIXED GREENS this afternoon. Then I found out tonight it is Earthbound Farms brand spinach that is the problem. I looked at what I ate today and saw it was Earthbound Farms brand AND there is spinach in the mixed greens!! I'm scared!!! I'm in the middle of a detox right now anyway....on the 9th day 100% raw after several months of being way off track. I searched online for symptoms of E.coli.... I found it can take 2 to 4 days or even up to 8 days to show up.

I'm downing glasses of apple cider vinegar cocktails. Anyone know of any other super germ/virus/bacteria fighting things I can take just in case???

The best thing to do is to try and stay calm. If you are in a detox, your body is at its best to fight off things anyway.

I have heard of olive leaf extract, there's also grapefruit seed extract, those are both used to boost the immune system.

And remember, 100 out of hundreds of thousands have gotten ill. These 100 could very well have poor diets and immune systems. You should be fine!!!

[michigan roman]

Yikes!!!!!! I started this thread yesterday when I saw it on the news, and then ate a bag of MIXED GREENS this afternoon. Then I found out tonight it is Earthbound Farms brand spinach that is the problem. I looked at what I ate today and saw it was Earthbound Farms brand AND there is spinach in the mixed greens!! I'm scared!!! I'm in the middle of a detox right now anyway....on the 9th day 100% raw after several months of being way off track. I searched online for symptoms of E.coli.... I found it can take 2 to 4 days or even up to 8 days to show up.

I'm downing glasses of apple cider vinegar cocktails. Anyone know of any other super germ/virus/bacteria fighting things I can take just in case???
from one of my herbals by nutritional author louise tenney , M.H. . =
garlic is a powerful antibacterial agent .
lemons destroy harmful bacteria .
myrrh is a fine antibacterial agent .

[lane]

i am so scared now, before learning about all of this this morning, i made a huge green smoothie with spinach from earthbound farms- and both myself and my 2 year old daughter drank it!!! what symptoms should i look for??
cc

[Spectatrix]

It's not just Earthbound Farms, guys and gals: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14841731/


Natural Selection Foods has recalled all packages of its fresh spinach and any salad with spinach in a blend because they are possibly contaminated with E. coli. The affected packages have “Best if Used by Dates” of Aug. 17 through Oct. 1. Consumers with questions can contact the company at 800-690-3200. The recalled brands are:
Bellissima
Cheney Brothers
Coastline
Compliments
Cross Valley
D’Arrigo Brothers
Dole
Earthbound Farm
Emeril
Fresh Point
Green Harvest
Jansal Valley
Mann
Mills Family Farm
Natural Selection Foods
Nature’s Basket
O Organic
Premium Fresh
President’s Choice
Pride of San Juan
Pro.Act
Pro-Mark
Rave Spinach
Ready Pac
River Ranch
Riverside Farms
Snoboy
Superior
Sysco
Tanimura & Antle
The Farmer’s Market
Trader Joe’s
I need to check what brand my spinach is when I get home... I ate some several days ago and haven't gotten sick, so I'm not terribly worried. Still, better safe than sorry and if it's one of the listed brands, I can get a refund/coupon anyway.

[pinkglttr]

Intestinal problems, diarrhea, blood in stool

[Spectatrix]

i am so scared now, before learning about all of this this morning, i made a huge green smoothie with spinach from earthbound farms- and both myself and my 2 year old daughter drank it!!! what symptoms should i look for??
cc
Symptoms are:

Abdominal cramps.
Severe, often bloody, diarrhea.
Kidney failure in the young, elderly or people with weak immune systems.

[romanticsnet]

I actually bought two huge boxes of Earthbound Organic Spinach yesterday. I usually try to stay away from bagged as it des not taste as good as the one from my CSA. However...I was running a little low. I made a salad and took it to work with me this morning just in case. and then saw the e-mail from the FDA. ( I am a subscriber to the Daily FDA Re-call list). You would be surprised how many products are infected with e-coli or Listeria Mono---- something! Usually there is always 2-3 products daily that are found to have contained traces of some ingredient that is not listed on the packaging.

Good thing I didn't eat the spinach! Although I do agree that being raw will help you overcome many ills and symptoms faster, some of us are still newbies or just transitioning, and are not completely able to fight off such bacteria yet. Better safe than sorry!

[GreenPrince]

Freesia,
I forgive you. ;)

Of course we should never eat contaminated food,
but all is about the amount of bacteria and the status of our immune
system. Every week we swallow e.coli of different strains by our food.

There is no coincidence that the EU-restrictions for spinach is based on
something quite different than microbes.

[dogmd]

Don't be afraid of bacteria! They are our friends and are an important part of the creation.
All of them have a positive task to fullfill; to brake down everything no longer viably,
to maintain the biological cycle. Imagine what would happen if the autumn leaves of the tree's
fell to the ground and never broked down to soil.

There is something crazy with this civilisation, when we think that bacteria is something
destructive, which we have to fight. There are no dangerous bacteria, only dangerious way
of living. A healthy person cannot be sick by bacteria. You have to first weaken your
immune system for a long time. And then get plentum of bacteria at once.

During my summer holidays in my late teens, I worked in a dairy laboratory and was
in charge for the bacteriological analysis of the milk products.

I found e.coli in all (pasteurized) milk we sold. I had colonies of millions of them in
petri dishes on my lab table, where I ate my veggi lunch.
E.coli? Oh, I love them, they are so beautiful...

The risk to dye of NOT eating spinach and greens is maybe 5 millions times higher than the
risk to dye of e.coli by infected green food. That's is 5'000'000:1. Which risk do you prefer?

Go on eating green food. Wash, eat and be happy!


VERY MUCH IN DISAGREEMENT WITH YOU HERE... E.Coli 0157 is a DEADLY pathogen. Granted there are other strains of E.Coli that aren't as pathogenic...but this is not the one to keep on eating, washing and being happy about. If this was YOUR CHILD that died from eating this bacteria, I don't think you would be encouraging others keep eating it. A lot of people don't know if they have weakened immune systems. All of the stress in the workplace and pollution in the environment stress/ attack our immune systems daily. Unfortunately this OUTBREAK has affected a raw food source. I am sad, because I love spinach in my green smoothies.It is however very UNWISE tell people that "there are no dangerous bacteria". I can list reams of bacteria that CAN KILL YOU.. strong immune system or not!!

I personally think it is safer to toss the spinach vs trying to wash it. I will NOT be feeding any green smoothies to my child anytime soon unless the greens come from grandpas garden!!!

[vgloveforlife]

I just bought 2 huge containers of earthbound Farms spinach the other day too and I don't usually buy spinach. I was planning what I was going to make with it the next day. The next morning I woke up to the e-coli news. I recieved the news just in time.
I will throw out both containers.

[rawfigure]

I just bought 2 huge containers of earthbound Farms spinach the other day too and I don't usually buy spinach. I was planning what I was going to make with it the next day. The next morning I woke up to the e-coli news. I recieved the news just in time.
I will throw out both containers.


My husband ate 1/2 a bag of Eartbbound yesterday w/ the offending date on the bag and he is fine BUT I still threw it out. Why risk it...you can get a refund if you so desire. See link to news article.

[alex]

E. coli is a normal intestinal inhabitant of ALL warm-blooded animals (that includes humans)!!

The contamination of the spinach is almost certainly due one of three things:

1) use of sewage sludge as a fertilizer (not suppose to be used on organic produce)

2) cross-contamination with meat or dairy products where E coli is ever present

3) use of manure that was not composted properly

I am really surprised that so many of you seem to buy the bagged/boxed produce. I can't put my finger on the article right now, but if there is going to be a problem like this, it is always with the bagged stuff.

There is really only one dangerous E coli: o157:h7. I guarantee you that you are ingesting E coli every single day!!! Think about it, they close the beaches in the summer only when the level of E coli gets too high.

E coli is everywhere!!!

Taking a probiotic really helps to balance the good bacteria with the 'not good' bacteria. And the state of the immune system is definitely a huge factor!


alex

[Dimond]

For those that are worried they might get e. coli, NutraMedix Samento is a natural antibiotic designed to get rid of e. coli/disease. I have more info on my website, including links you can go to. If you do a google search on Samento & e. coli, you can find out more. You can purchase directly from the company or several other places on the internet. Maybe even contact the company to find out if there are any retailers near you so you can get this quickly enough. I take it myself for health reasons and probably always will as a precautionary.

Colloidal Silver, if you have on hand, may help as well, though Samento is stronger.

http://tinyurl.com/gy4hy

Obviously this isn't something to play around with if you believe you have it, go to a doctor/hospital.

[pinkglttr]

Actually, the fields were NOT contaminated purposely. There was a flood and apparently the water contained feces.

Let's not get into a blame game about irresponsible producers, it was an accident.

[Oceana]

I just bought 2 huge containers of earthbound Farms spinach the other day too and I don't usually buy spinach. I was planning what I was going to make with it the next day. The next morning I woke up to the e-coli news. I recieved the news just in time.
I will throw out both containers.

Why not just return it ang get your money back?

[Oceana]

E. coli is a normal intestinal inhabitant of ALL warm-blooded animals (that includes humans)!!

The contamination of the spinach is almost certainly due one of three things:

1) use of sewage sludge as a fertilizer (not suppose to be used on organic produce)

2) cross-contamination with meat or dairy products where E coli is ever present

3) use of manure that was not composted properly

I am really surprised that so many of you seem to buy the bagged/boxed produce. I can't put my finger on the article right now, but if there is going to be a problem like this, it is always with the bagged stuff.

There is really only one dangerous E coli: o157:h7. I guarantee you that you are ingesting E coli every single day!!! Think about it, they close the beaches in the summer only when the level of E coli gets too high.

E coli is everywhere!!!

Taking a probiotic really helps to balance the good bacteria with the 'not good' bacteria. And the state of the immune system is definitely a huge factor!


alex
Are you saying this is not dangerous?
We really need to careful with what we say here.
We dont know how much ecoli is in "a contaminated bag" , there could be VERY contaminated bags and LOW contaminated bags.
To be safe it should all be trashed.

[Pailani]

I am really surprised that so many of you seem to buy the bagged/boxed produce. I can't put my finger on the article right now, but if there is going to be a problem like this, it is always with the bagged stuff.

Any explanation for why it's always the bagged stuff? If a flood contaminates a field of spinach, how is unbagged stuff from the field okay, and the bagged spinach not okay?

[vgloveforlife]

Oceana-I only paid $1.98 for it so it's just not worth it to me to bring it back and get a refund. If I had paid retail for it it would of cost a lot more and then I would of got my money back.

Pailini-I'm wondering the same thing. Anyone know?

[Sharon in Colorado]

Any explanation for why it's always the bagged stuff? If a flood contaminates a field of spinach, how is unbagged stuff from the field okay, and the bagged spinach not okay?


I was thinking the same thing Pailani. Doesn't seem to make sense if it was in the water.

However, the local news here reported that our Wild Oats pulled ALL spinach from the shelves, not just the bagged kind.

[rawnora]

It is very helpful in these matters to gain an understanding of how disease truly works. Children get sick and die at an alarming rate from the civilized practices that their parents subject them to. Children become symptomatic as their bodies try to urgently eliminate the harmful substances that are accumulating and circulating through their bloodstreams, and the parents suppress these life-saving bodily measures with remedies and medicines. If before that happens the body has been able to bring the dangerous accumulation down to a functional level, symptoms may stop. If it hasn't, symptoms may get worse. When they get worse, more medicines are administered. In some cases the body can overcome both the original causative factors and the onslaught of medicines, but in many cases it can't and children die. In those cases, it is never the causative factors plus the medicines that are considered as the culprits. Rather, microscopic life forms are blamed. We are supposed to ignore all of the well-intentioned assaults that were visited on the child, and which really caused the death. In the aftermath, to add insult to injury, the public is misinformed about the causes, businesses are sued, manufacturers are wrongly punished, misguided laws are passed and we are all admonished to perform supposedly preventative practices like cooking our meat thoroughly or discarding "contaminated" products. All the while, the real causes of these deaths don't even get speculated about.

Incredible as it may seem, the link from bacteria to sickness has never been proven by its promoters or believers, nor could it ever be. That's because there is no causative connection. Bacteria simply congregate where their food supply (dead organic matter) is. They are innocent by-standers. NONE of them is harmful or deadly. They are absolutely ubiquitous; they are everywhere and we could not live without them nor could any living organism.

More information on this topic can be found in the works of Herbert Shelton, TC Fry, Arnold Ehret and John Tilden, for those who are open to exploring other than "conventional wisdom".

Regards,
Nora
www.RawSchool.com

[Sharon in Colorado]

Oceana-I only paid $1.98 for it so it's just not worth it to me to bring it back and get a refund. If I had paid retail for it it would of cost a lot more and then I would of got my money back.

Pailini-I'm wondering the same thing. Anyone know?

You can just call the 800 number and they will send you a coupon for another one. I have more than one that I needed to toss, I am hoping they'll at least send me a couple of them.

[dogmd]

Incredible as it may seem, the link from bacteria to sickness has never been proven by its promoters or believers, nor could it ever be. That's because there is no causative connection. Bacteria simply congregate where their food supply (dead organic matter) is. They are innocent by-standers. NONE of them is harmful or deadly. They are absolutely ubiquitous; they are everywhere and we could not live without them nor could any living organism.

More information on this topic can be found in the works of Herbert Shelton, TC Fry, Arnold Ehret and John Tilden, for those who are open to exploring other than "conventional wisdom".

Regards,
Nora
www.RawSchool.com

Wow... I am in complete disagreement with you as well.. How can you say there has never been a causative connection between bacteria and sickness? My husband and I almost died from a bacterial pathogen (food borne illness) called Shigella ( a gram negative bacteria) which I contracted by eating infected 3-layer dip from trader joes 5 years ago. This organism ended up in my food because an employee that prepared it did not wash his hands after using the restroom. Thousands of other people got sick as well and the CDC came out and documented the source of our illness by doing a fecal gram stain on my feces while I was in the hospital.

Again.. if you or your child were the ones who had died during this outbreak, I am sure you would not be saying that bacteria are innocent by-standers. I can list many other organisms that can cause illness and death, but I am just absolutely amazed that you don't think bacteria are harmful.

Question for you? What do you think caused this childs death during this e.coli outbreak? or for that matter, what so you think caused the deaths of the postal workers and others during the anthrax outbreak a few years ago? E coli 0157 and bacillus anthracis are both very pathogenic bacteria, both gram negative anaerobes and both very deadly! Please take a microbiology course if you would really like to understand bacterial pathogenicity!!

[rawnora]

Children who are properly fed and raised do not get sickness of any kind, including e-coli. In all of the instances where bacteria are blamed for these deaths, the real causes of death are ignored. In addition, it is usually the case that many people who ate the same thing do not even get sick.

I understand how difficult it is to accept the truth about disease, especially for those who have been trained by the system which benefits so greatly from continued widespread belief in the germ theory. Imagine a world where people took responsibility for their own sickness and had no scapegoat to blame their ills on.

I urge all who are intrigued by what I've written here to explore it further. If you look close enough, you will find that there is no scientific basis for many of the unquestioned tenets of the medical belief system, including the idea that medicines cure and that bacteria cause disease.

Regards,
Nora
www.RawSchool.com

[Spectatrix]

Nora --

What do you believe to be the true causes of disease? If diet is the only factor, then why did deaths and illnesses decline after the development of the germ theory of disease and Joseph Lister's subsequent development of antiseptic procedures? Why do animals, who generally have a natural biologically-appropriate diet, come down with illnesses?

I have no doubt that exercise and a healthy diet foster one's immune system and, as such, people who eat right may come down with illnesses less often, but that doesn't mean that bacteria have no role in disease.

[romanticsnet]

Rawnora, Salmonella Germ is a group of bacteria, is it not? I have read both sides of the argument. But one thing is clear. A few months ago I had a tainted bag of raw Costco almonds that I kept in my freezer. Every time I ate from them over a course of a few weeks... I got very ill. (diarrhea and flu-like symptoms) I did not put two and two together, until I relaized after the 4th time... that it was the almonds, and found out that Costco had done a recall on the "raw" almonds. I don't even think that they sell "raw" almonds anymore because of this. The almonds were tainted with Salmonella. So... was it my imagination? I diid not even know about the contamination till after I had done some research.

[luckitri]

romanticsnet, I am sorry to hear about the Costco raw almonds because they have had recalls in years past for the same problem. I would like to know the source of the problem and why is it just Costco's that get recalled - or get the most attention about it? Now I am afraid to eat any nuts from there - hubby just bought Pine Nuts in Kirkland bag 'cause he's a nut freak. So I guess rawnora is saying that we would not get the salmonella either if we had our bodies in proper balance. I for one have started green juicing today with a vengeance. I even juiced okra to get my potassium balance up and bought leafy greens to increase my nutrition and alkalinity. I learned that I like mono juices - like the organic kale. I also bought dandelion greens but they sure don't taste like the ones I used to pick - these are very bitter. I also learned about oil-pulling on this site last night and hubby and I started it today. I am doing the olive leaf extract recommended to me here as well as powdered vitamin C, and yes I have some colloidal silver in the cupboard and shortly will be making my coconut blend which is supposed to have healing properties. I am possibly exposed to Hanta, West Nile Virus, and now the eColi. There is so much to learn! I wish I could just get a synopsis of what rawnora is trying to teach us because I have to go at least clean the filthy house! Oh at my local health food store this a.m. they said that they had pulled all the spinach from the store but there was some loose spinach over by the lettuces. I really really love spinach juice but as someone here pointed out - why would it just be in the bagged? Well possibly the contaminated fields were harvested only for bagged and boxed stuff but it still just does not make sense to me.

Edit: If I am just doing juices and therefore am not hungy does this mean that I am fasting? (Haven't learned about fasting yet.)

[Spectatrix]

romanticsnet -- Yes, salmonella is a bacterium.

I presume that the loose-leaf spinach is produced by different companies from different fields and that's why it's not affected.

[Oceana]

Children who are properly fed and raised do not get sickness of any kind, including e-coli. In all of the instances where bacteria are blamed for these deaths, the real causes of death are ignored. In addition, it is usually the case that many people who ate the same thing do not even get sick.

I understand how difficult it is to accept the truth about disease, especially for those who have been trained by the system which benefits so greatly from continued widespread belief in the germ theory. Imagine a world where people took responsibility for their own sickness and had no scapegoat to blame their ills on.

I urge all who are intrigued by what I've written here to explore it further. If you look close enough, you will find that there is no scientific basis for many of the unquestioned tenets of the medical belief system, including the idea that medicines cure and that bacteria cause disease.

Regards,
Nora
www.RawSchool.com

I had a reply ready; then deleted it, but fighting is not worth it. I dont know where you got your info from but you are wrong. The bad thing about the net is anyone can lie. Just remember Karma's a BlTCH.

Goodluck to all of you..

Signing out of "Raw Food."

[Sharon in Colorado]

I had a reply ready; then deleted it, but fighting is not worth it. I dont know where you got your info from but you are wrong. The bad thing about the net is anyone can lie. Just remember Karma's a BlTCH.

Goodluck to all of you..

Signing out of "Raw Food."

Now why did you have to go and write that? There is no fight here - it is an interesting discussion.

[Cinnamon]

This is really an interesting discussion, all the various points of view. After reading all the posts here I thought I'd check the box of spinach I'd been eating this week and indeed it is from Earthbound Farms with the dates listed being the ones containing E. coli.

I threw the spinach out yesterday and the last I ate of it would have been on Thursday. I juiced some of it and also had a large green smoothie Thursday and the day before. It was a huge box and I'd eaten half of it.

Thankfully I feel fine, guess I'll just monitor myself and hope I avoid any problems. I hope those who also ate this are doing okay!

[Veganforlife]

I agree. I like "listening" to what everyone has to say. It makes me feel bad when folks feel like they are "fighting". Hey! There's no mad cows here - at least I don't think so... :o

[Freesia]

Yep a good healthy discussion is good. Well I think that even the healthiest raw food diet isnt going to prevent you from dieing from some nasty bug you may ingest. Yes natural selection takes hold and the sicker people sucumb to what ever illness, virus or whatever killer it maybe is going around. There are some things so nasty that any diet will not save you. Sure if you grow your own organic pruduce you will not have to deal with this problem but if there are animals that come into your yard and use your plot for a potty you are suceptible to whatever they may have. If they have some kind of disease that has popped up to kill off some of their species to save their population ??? That is nature. How overpopulated is this earth? Off the bacteria subject for a minute but where do all the diseases and viruses pop up like bird flu, sars etc....... the most populated areas. Sure the healthier you are the more likely you will not die from this bacteria but it can make you very ill. Take is seriously. Don't overreact and think "oh I will never eat bagged spinach again" This problem come up from time to time. It is the risk involved in eating mass produced foods. Do your research, buy from local farmers if you can. IF you can not then at least keep up on the advisories and take them seriously and do not be ingnorant to the facts.

Sorry and people grow up, don't be so offended when someone does not agree with you. It is annoying and I am sorry if someone has made someone else feel bad but take it for what it is. People will always disagree about any subject. Be considerate of others and listen to what they say if you do not agree so be it or it may get you thinking another way .......more information you have the better you are. Ok in most cases

[Freesia]

Wow... I am in complete disagreement with you as well.. How can you say there has never been a causative connection between bacteria and sickness? My husband and I almost died from a bacterial pathogen (food borne illness) called Shigella ( a gram negative bacteria) which I contracted by eating infected 3-layer dip from trader joes 5 years ago. This organism ended up in my food because an employee that prepared it did not wash his hands after using the restroom. Thousands of other people got sick as well and the CDC came out and documented the source of our illness by doing a fecal gram stain on my feces while I was in the hospital.

Again.. if you or your child were the ones who had died during this outbreak, I am sure you would not be saying that bacteria are innocent by-standers. I can list many other organisms that can cause illness and death, but I am just absolutely amazed that you don't think bacteria are harmful.

Question for you? What do you think caused this childs death during this e.coli outbreak? or for that matter, what so you think caused the deaths of the postal workers and others during the anthrax outbreak a few years ago? E coli 0157 and bacillus anthracis are both very pathogenic bacteria, both gram negative anaerobes and both very deadly! Please take a microbiology course if you would really like to understand bacterial pathogenicity!!

Good of you to share your experience and I h ope others will learn from it. People do not always use good sanitation. Disease is spread and we are at risk particularly because we do not cook our food.

[Freesia]

Yeah. That's not a "more reason to go raw." The spinach IS raw. That's more reason to go cooked. :(

NOOOOO you cannot cook it out and I never heard anyone use that argument when talking about this outbreak. Don't overreact and take it seriously

[GreenPrince]

VERY MUCH IN DISAGREEMENT WITH YOU HERE... E.Coli 0157 is a DEADLY pathogen. Granted there are other strains of E.Coli that aren't as pathogenic...but this is not the one to keep on eating, washing and being happy about. If this was YOUR CHILD that died from eating this bacteria, I don't think you would be encouraging others keep eating it. A lot of people don't know if they have weakened immune systems. All of the stress in the workplace and pollution in the environment stress/ attack our immune systems daily. Unfortunately this OUTBREAK has affected a raw food source. I am sad, because I love spinach in my green smoothies.It is however very UNWISE tell people that "there are no dangerous bacteria". I can list reams of bacteria that CAN KILL YOU.. strong immune system or not!!

I personally think it is safer to toss the spinach vs trying to wash it. I will NOT be feeding any green smoothies to my child anytime soon unless the greens come from grandpas garden!!!I have read every row and I completely agree.
I cut down ¾ of my original textbefore posting and I can see that the whole purport was losed. I regret this.

My original text had a much broader perspective of risk/award: bacteriological/biochemical risks of spinach contra health gains. It was too long and contained facts I thought nobody wants to hear.

Of course, I encourage nobody to eat contaminated food, and dogmd, that list with reams of dangerous bacteria... well, don't send bread to a baker... ;)

[Freesia]

It has happened countless times with meat. More often than with a veggie. So this too will pass and not damage the reputation of Spinach.

Look at the Deaths from Raw Burger...and look at how many still eat it ??

A great book about this topic is John Robbins new book..Food Revolution...my DH hates it when I read to him from it about the meat industry. I show him picture, tell him about a factory farm and he says lets go eat..I feel like a Steak... :mad: :mad:

It has and it does. Don't you watch the news?

[mongomango]

Any explanation for why it's always the bagged stuff? If a flood contaminates a field of spinach, how is unbagged stuff from the field okay, and the bagged spinach not okay?


Yes, there is an explanation. Most contamination of vegetables comes from the washwater in the processing of the veggie, not in the fields, not from employees not washing their hands, but in the water they use to wash the cut greens with...which is used again and again and again, and is really quite filthy. There are videos on the net floating around if you want to search...and you'll see the water looks like coffee. I would not believe any explanation the fda puts out as they are corrupt and no longer serve the american public but big industry.

Those who are frightened who ate spinach should get some grapefruit seed extract and take 5 drops in an 6 oz glass of water and drink it 3-5 times a day for a few days. If you are on prescription medicines, call your doctor first to ask if any of your meds are rendered useless by grapefruit...a large number of meds interact with grapefruit, even if you eat grapefruit.

Those who have the greens and are determined to eat them, put 10 or so drops of grapefruit seed extract in a big bowl of water and soak your veggies in it for 20 minutes. It should kill the nasties. RINSE very well, gs extract is highly bitter.

I, for one, actually believe there is a conspiracy against raw. There is raw, and then there's raw which is irradiated..now they are wanting to spray fluoride on all fruits and veggies...etc. Many people get sick, and yes, die from dairy, meat, eggs, etc. every year but the mass media is not covering those stories like they do anything having to do with raw veggies or sprouts making one sick. Keep in mind also that this is also a time when they put out news that is not generally good for the public, but because of the fear generated, it is accepted...for example the fact that the fda has now approved processors to put a virus in meat....or the fact that the fda is now taking comment of putting a live herpes virus into a chicken vaccine.

If you can garden, imo, you should really do so if only in self defense.

edit: if you cannot use gs extract, use oil of oregano

[mongomango]

Actually the big problem here (other than people getting E-coli) is that now people are even more afraid to eat raw produce. At the end of all these news articles it usually is telling people to thoroughly cook all their produce and not buy things raw. More people tend to listen to the head honchos and FDA than to actual reason. So now we have yet another group of people saying that raw is 'dangerous'. The government and supermarkets have already begun dipping foods in hot water baths so now it is just a matter of time before all of our leafy greens are pre-boiled or sprayed with junk as well just so that that everyone in the food industry can cover their behinds.

I'm really upset about this because as it stands I can't grow my own food until we have a house with a yard and I buy mixed organic greens to make my green smoothies and they contain some spinach. I NEED my greens and now I'm afraid to buy/eat them because I don't want to get E-coli. I'm concerned with all the negative publicity raw produce is going to get because of this. I wish that they would find the source already, this is taking them forever. This case is about a month old now and they still haven't figured it out.

Why couldn't this have happened with some other food like meat or milk or something that is actually bad for one's health??? This is ridiculous.


You can grow greens without a yard.

Here is a link

http://www.containerseeds.com/articles/mesclunarticle.html

That's for mesclun (mixed baby greens) but you can do lettuce in containers on the floor by a window...

I live in a warehouse, I have no land, I have grown in containers, tomatoes, peppers, zucchini, lettuce, spinach, cucumbers, etc.

Just growing greens is pretty easy.

You can also get unhulled buckwheat and sunflower seeds, and put soil (has to be soil, not potting mixture) in a cafeteria type tray, put the seeds down heavily, and let them grow for 8 days or so...baby greens, very cleansing and healing. You can add pea shoots to the mix as well.

Here is a link to show you how http://www.geocities.com/~newliberty/earthstar/greens.htm

And to really pack in the nutrients...you can buy this...
http://www.oceangrown.com/

Mix it with water per the directions, put it in a spray bottle, and spray your greens with it daily for awesome mineral content.

[dogmd]

I have read every row and I completely agree.
I cut down ¾ of my original textbefore posting and I can see that the whole purport was losed. I regret this.

My original text had a much broader perspective of risk/award: bacteriological/biochemical risks of spinach contra health gains. It was too long and contained facts I thought nobody wants to hear.

Of course, I encourage nobody to eat contaminated food, and dogmd, that list with reams of dangerous bacteria... well, don't send bread to a baker... ;)

:) Thanks Green Prince! :)

[dogmd]

Children who are properly fed and raised do not get sickness of any kind, including e-coli. In all of the instances where bacteria are blamed for these deaths, the real causes of death are ignored. In addition, it is usually the case that many people who ate the same thing do not even get sick.

I understand how difficult it is to accept the truth about disease, especially for those who have been trained by the system which benefits so greatly from continued widespread belief in the germ theory. Imagine a world where people took responsibility for their own sickness and had no scapegoat to blame their ills on.

I urge all who are intrigued by what I've written here to explore it further. If you look close enough, you will find that there is no scientific basis for many of the unquestioned tenets of the medical belief system, including the idea that medicines cure and that bacteria cause disease.

Regards,
Nora
www.RawSchool.com

Your theory is mind boggling! :confused:

I have looked very closely ( especially when I almost died) and my scientific basis was rock solid. I do agree with you that there are some children and adults that never get sick. Whether that be from a balanced nutrition or from just great genes who really knows. But this is not the norm.

Can U please let me know WHAT YOU THINK THE REAL CAUSES OF THESE DEATHS ARE? You keep eluding to something, but I am still confused.

[sno white]

I am a newbie and have just recently started trying to eat raw. When things like this happen I don’t have a clue what to do.

If I understand correctly the FDA said that washing the spinach wouldn’t solve the problem because the bacteria are too tightly attached and they recommended through cooking because cooking kills the bacterium. However, T.J. Bucholz said. "If they feel like they have to eat it, wash it first in warm water."

I have some bagged spinach and DH Wants me to either throw it out or cook it. I don’t know what to do.

[pinkglttr]

I am a newbie and have just recently started trying to eat raw. When things like this happen I don’t have a clue what to do.

If I understand correctly the FDA said that washing the spinach wouldn’t solve the problem because the bacteria are too tightly attached and they recommended through cooking because cooking kills the bacterium. However, T.J. Bucholz said. "If they feel like they have to eat it, wash it first in warm water."

I have some bagged spinach and DH Wants me to either through it out or cook it. I don’t know what to do.

Throw it out, why take the chance? People are dying for a green vegetable. To me, eating it is irrational.

[mongomango]

agreed. toss it.

It's an unusual situation and nothing wrong with being safe, and it's not worth the chance of getting sick for something that cost only a few bucks.

I'd have tossed it already. If you don't, see my post above and get you some grapefruit seed extract.

[rawnora]

It's always disconcerting when the truth is so hidden and elusive that one is perceived to be a rebel for suggesting it. Acute sickness is a body-initiated process to eliminate poisons. There are no exceptions. Bacteria are not poisonous to us, they feed on the poisons we eat and otherwise ingest. The by-products of their metabolism are poisonous to us, but these are easily eliminated by a healthy body and do not cause disease except by contributing in a minor way to the other factors which do.

When children get sick, it is because they are vaccinated, medicated when they are symptomatic, fed cereals and other inappropriate foods before they should even be weaned, and much more abuse that is not even recognized as such. As Herbert Shelton wrote in his book, "The Hygienic Care of Children", "When one considers the abuse that parents and physicians heap upon children, it causes him to marvel, not that so many children die, but that so few die. For, he soon sees that the child enters a conflict against sinister foes the day it is born, even granting that it has not been forced to fight with them before birth." But of course, as we know, the 'fight' starts long before birth, during gestation when fetuses are forced to develop on whatever inappropriate fare the mother sees fit to eat. If a child makes it past age 3-4, it is common practice to introduce junk foods such as what is served at McDonalds and Jack in the Box. Yet when they get sick and die after eating such foods, we get our microscopes out and start looking for tiny lifeforms that are innocent and ubiquitous.

I wish I had been the one to discover and first write about the truth about disease causation, but with all the convincing propaganda that has been spread since the inception of the germ theory, a genius along the order of Herbert Shelton was needed. There were actually others before him, such as those I named in my earlier post, but Shelton's writings are the most prolific and uncompromising. The information is there for anyone with sufficient interest to seek it out and an open mind to see the self-evident logic in it. The "Life Science" course that I sell on my website has a full lesson devoted to dispelling the flawed germ theory, and includes essays by hygiene pioneers.

Regards,
Nora
www.RawSchool.com

[wyjoz]

Any explanation for why it's always the bagged stuff? If a flood contaminates a field of spinach, how is unbagged stuff from the field okay, and the bagged spinach not okay?

Because the bags are sealed they reproduce faster due to lack of oxygen!

[romanticsnet]

It's always disconcerting when the truth is so hidden and elusive that one is perceived to be a rebel for suggesting it. Acute sickness is a body-initiated process to eliminate poisons. There are no exceptions. Bacteria are not poisonous to us, they feed on the poisons we eat and otherwise ingest.


So.. what you are saying is that we are being poisoned .. by what we eat.. but it is not bacteria. Do you have another name besides poison??? Because, I am having a hard time with this one. I know someone brought up chicken pox in another thread, and how could they get chicken pox except by transmission... tell me is it just a matter of terminology that we are missing here? What exactly is poisoning us if not these types of bacteria or viruses? I would like to understand. :)

[michigan roman]

So.. what you are saying is that we are being poisoned .. by what we eat.. but it is not bacteria. Do you have another name besides poison??? Because, I am having a hard time with this one. I know someone brought up chicken pox in another thread, and how could they get chicken pox except by transmission... tell me is it just a matter of terminology that we are missing here? What exactly is poisoning us if not these types of bacteria or viruses? I would like to understand. :)


i believe what shes saying is that cooked foods become poisons because our cells cant burn all of the inorganic (dead/cooked) particles for fuel so they become waste that the bacteria feed on , if this waste wasnt present the bacteria would have nothing to feed on and thusly couldnt multiply and become a problem . so shes calling cooked food poison . because a person living on raw plant matter wouldnt have this cellular waste present and thusly thered be nothing for the bacteria to feed on and so it would die off and do no harm .

[Wendee]

Last week, I had huge stomach pains, very bad gas and diarhea really bad. This lasted about four days after I had eaten bagged spinach. Fatigue settled in for a few days, then boom. Gone. No symptoms except gas left but my DH says that I always have that.

Do you think it could have been ecoli?