Just a thought

[Seren]

Ive been wondering lately, the raw food diet is a way of tying to eat as naturally as possible, as our ancestors did. What our ancestors did was go out and look for their food, they couldnt ship in products from abroad, or from other countries.

Now, these days, the raw food diet often requires a lot of shipping things from other countries, for me, I even have to eat a lot of shipped fruit as most of the best fruit such as pineapples, bananas, mangoes and papayas dont grow over here in Britain.

Im just thinking, maybe I shouldnt eat anything thats shipped? That would mean having practically only apples and pears as fruit :( So I am very torn over what to do.

A big part of the raw lifestyle is also trying to create as little harm as possible to the environment. If Im eating food from other countries, Im supporting the shipping of foods, which means I am contributing to the pollution from the vehichles transporting these foods.

Does anybody have any thoughts on this? Ive been thinking about it a lot lately and wondering what to do bout it.

Seren x x

[Jordann]

This is a great question. :D

I agree that the raw diet is about eating as naturally as possible, but I don't think it's really about eating like our ancestors did. I myself have no desire to emulate the days of yore, because modern living is radically different in every way. From our lifestyle (in Westernized societies) to the quality of the air we breathe, the water we drink and bathe in, the unprecendented amount of technologies in our homes...

I personally would not thrive (or maybe even survive) if I were eating how I imagine ancestoral humans ate! :cool: My nutritional needs are vastly changed - my body is under crazy stress coming from all angles and in the present day, we are blessed (in a way) with being able to give our bodies the widest variety of foodstuffs ever.

However, those opinions are at odds with the next thing you mention, which is essentially eating locally. I often think about the consequences of my many pounds of bananas from Ecuador, or mangoes from Peru, pineapples flown in "jet-fresh" from Hawaii. And the majority of my organic produce comes from California, or Mexico. Thousands and thousands or air and road miles are bringing this food to me, which means tonnes and tonnes of emissions, and I don't know how much oil. :confused: It's a tough one.

I know things like the 100-mile diet are becoming increasingly popular, where you eat entirely seasonally and locally, nothing coming from further than 100 miles of where one lives. This would be a challenge at first, to someone like me, who is VERY accustomed to eating many tropical fruits for example. :eek:

Perhaps this is a reason that long-time raw fooders, especially those who consume mainly fruit, happen to live (or re-locate) to warmer climates where fruits grow in diverse abundance. It certainly has crossed my mind! :rolleyes:

I guess I'm in the same boat. On one hand ---- and the other hand ---- Of course I still eat all my tropical fruits and far off organic produce, so I suppose I'm not THAT bothered by it (which bothers me some :rolleyes: )

I look forward to seeing what others think about this. Thanks for bringing up the issue~

[sport]

Your envoirnment in Wales is capable of producing a much greater variety than just pears and apples.
I heard a lady on the radio lately that grows blueberries in her window and eats 30 per day. She plans to double her output next year and eat 60 per day. She is in her nineties.
Is there any chance that you can get an allotment from your local council. Some councils over there operate them and they are a briliant idea.

[sport]

[QUOTE=Jordann] I often think about the consequences of my many pounds of bananas from Ecuador, or mangoes from Peru, pineapples flown in "jet-fresh" from Hawaii. And the majority of my organic produce comes from California, or Mexico. Thousands and thousands or air and road miles are bringing this food to me, which means tonnes and tonnes of emissions, and I don't know how much oil. :confused: It's a tough one.
QUOTE]
There are other consequences. I recall hearing that the Tsuanami in Asia last year was so devestating because thay had stripped out all their natural vegetation to grow stuf for us and the new growth just could not withstand the onslaught.

[Graciebeliever]

So one might ponder and say then... We have the best of both worlds :)

The wisdom now to eat what is right and simple as those who came before us in a more simple time, and the bountiful pleasures of eating ALL that is available to us in this modern era.

Yes it does make one wonder....

I say then, We are very blessed and as long as we use our wisdom and do it right and use what is best from both old and new and not abuse it. It is all right before us and we should NOT take it for granted.

Ok.. That was deep, I'm gonna go eat a Banana :D

[Jordann]

I'm sure we could brainstorm up a list far FAR longer than I offered! That's another one that's huge, the deforestation, destroying habitats, desertification... probably extinction of hundreds of species too... not to mention the effects on the countries economies and self-sufficiency. Further perpetuation of the gross economic disparity across the globe. What else???
This is an excellent way to become more aware of the far reaching implications of things I daily take for granted!

[Seren]

Sport, I never knew that we could grow blueberries over here, I was exaggerating a bit saying just apples and pears, as I know we can grow strawberries and raspberries here too, even though its just in summer. Its a great Idea to try and get an allotment, or I could try and grow some stuff in my garden. I'll see how things go.

Jordann, I agree that the modern way of living affects greatly the ease at which we can be raw. I find it very hard living in my house, as my parents sort of ridicule me for wanting me to be completely raw, and often buy bread, and yoghurt and cheese etc, which, when theres not a lot of veggies, and a microwave and plenty of other food to hand that it seems so much harder to be raw than just eat like the rest of my family.

I think though, that Sport's idea of growing my own vegetables and fruit, is great, I had thought of doing it before but I think Im really going to try and do it.

I think what Ive decided on on this subject, is that Im goin to try and eat mainly food locally, but if I occasionally have some mango and pineapple.. well thats just life lol.

Also, another thing that was on my mind is dehydrators.

Are they really healthy? Because even though it doesnt cook the food, it removes a lot of the water, which is one of the great things about fresh raw food, that it has a lot of water in it?

Seren xXx

[Pailani]

Somebody here once said that originally, everybody lived in tropical locations and thrived on tropical fruits. It's a lot easier to have the foods we're supposed to eat (if that's true) shipped to us, than for all of us to move back to the tropics.

[Tirza]

[QUOTE=sportThere are other consequences. I recall hearing that the Tsuanami in Asia last year was so devestating because thay had stripped out all their natural vegetation to grow stuf for us and the new growth just could not withstand the onslaught.[/QUOTE]

That is a hard one. Talk about our consumer demands causing devastating effects on the local economies. But just remember that the don't HAVE an economy to speak of if they don't export. Having said that, here is the question: Just what do these countries want to do with the money from their exports? They want to modernize (Westernize). And as we all know, that is a never ending treadmill. We are so consumer-driven that it is really horrifying to think of it.

When everyone had to live on locally-grown products and had to make a lot of their own, they adapted. Sure, they didn't have the lifestyle that we have, but we could do that in a modified way. We at least have the option of storing our seasonal foods much more efficiently than they did "back then". We can freeze. I know they dehydrated, but we can do it so much easier. We can do like they did and put up greenhouses, but now we have heating and lighting to grow things out of season or we can do it inside our MUCH larger homes. (Herbs, sprouts, even tomatoes etc.)

When this topic comes up, I get this hopeless feeling like "what difference will it make anyway". If I and few hundred or thousand others do this, what difference will it make? Will we by our example actually change the world? Did the Hippies? All I can see of their legacy is the free sex revolution and widespread drug use. Most of the focus on natural living and eating and the co-op farms etc. went quietly into ruin. The organic movement is just one more tiny oddity in our society. Isn't it sad?

[eachpeachpearplum]

Somebody here once said that originally, everybody lived in tropical locations and thrived on tropical fruits. It's a lot easier to have the foods we're supposed to eat (if that's true) shipped to us, than for all of us to move back to the tropics.


Actually I feel this is a VERY valid point. I have always wanted to eat as we "did". But then our ancestors did not live in very cold climates and I feel those that did migrated with the seasons.

So while I feel it is best to try to eat locally produced foods genetically we hark back to tropical fruits & vegs and so are fine to eat these too. Also so many of our "local foods" were origanlly brought over from other countries. . . :rolleyes:

[Gosia]

I think too that since most of us do not live in the optimal climat with the optimal food surronding us, relying on the food that is shipped is a necessity. Nevertheless, I think that we can still improve our diet by far if we grow as much of our food as possible, or buy locally grown fruit/vegies. So, Luke and I decided to plant many fruit trees in our backyard (so far this number is about 10 and growing), but of course, only those varieties that will grow here. I wish I could plant bananas, rock-melons, durians and other tropical fruit. But because I can't, I settle on apples, pears, figs, persimmons, cherries, peaches, nectarines etc. We also planted grapes and began growing the greens. My tastebuds tell me that sweet fruit is the best food for me. So I will continue buying bananas and other tropical fruit that can't grow here.

Gosia

[LeanAndHungry]

I bet it's possible to grow all your own food in all but the worst environments, like the arctic. I don't have any evidence or experience to backup that claim, but it must be true. Animals do it. With our intellect we ought to find a way to do what animals can do out of pure instinct. It would probably result in a large reduction in variety, but I think a person could still thrive.

[lissomllama]

You're correct, but our ancestors lived in a different time where climates were different and they most likely lived in warmer climates before migrating over to colder lands such as Europe. They probably had a wider selection of things and were healthy because of that. I wouldn't think that you would be very healthy eating only indigenous vegetation because it is such a lack of variety in your foods and while it is a shame to contribute to pollution by shipping, your eating raw is conserving way more resources than you know. The small amount of fruit you take in that is shipped really doesn't make much of a dent as society as a whole does. However, you might do a little better by starting up a garden of your own and eating as much as you can from there and then cut the amount of imported stuff you eat in half. But still, I wouldn't worry about this if I were you. It is hard enough to get good produce in stores as it is. You need a variety in your diet to get all the nutrients you need. That is my advice. But, kudos on the good observations.

[Pailani]

When this topic comes up, I get this hopeless feeling like "what difference will it make anyway". If I and few hundred or thousand others do this, what difference will it make? Will we by our example actually change the world? Did the Hippies? All I can see of their legacy is the free sex revolution and widespread drug use. Most of the focus on natural living and eating and the co-op farms etc. went quietly into ruin. The organic movement is just one more tiny oddity in our society.

I don't know, organic seems to be more mainstream these days - on parenting message boards, new parents often buy only organic foods for their babies. It's not an "oddity" for people I know, it's just too expensive to buy all the time. And I'm seeing more and more organic food in the regular grocery stores. The idea of natural living and eating wasn't a bad idea - just the way they went about it was more idealistic than practical. If every time we slip-up is supposed to teach us something individually, then globally, a culture's failures are an opportunity to learn and improve. I think the current interest in vegan diets and the raw movement are both outgrowths of what the hippies started.

[Tirza]

Yes, Pailani you are right. I was hoping for change too fast in only a few decades. We have to realize what a little blip we really are on the timeline. These things seem small now but can have long lasting effects and perhaps change the whole course of things for future generations. We can hope.

[mellisamouse]

All I can say is I am truly blessed to have found such a group of wonderful and conciencious people. I say, follow your heart and your concience. Don't be too hard on yourself though, I think, well, they would stil send all these bananas weather I buy them or not, so I am no exactly DIRECTLY responsible, KWIM?

[Lay-Lay]

I won't think about this today...I do my best. I have a big garden. I pick what grows naturally around my house. But bananas don't grow on trees here sooo.....

[Lay-Lay]

P.S.
If I have my pick between flordia grown or california grown produce I usually pick the one closes to me.

[swingbolder]

I often think about the consequences of my many pounds of bananas from Ecuador, or mangoes from Peru, pineapples flown in "jet-fresh" from Hawaii. And the majority of my organic produce comes from California, or Mexico. Thousands and thousands or air and road miles are bringing this food to me, which means tonnes and tonnes of emissions, and I don't know how much oil.

I think about this too.

But then I think about how pretty much all of our consumer goods are shipped from overseas these days, so why single out the food we eat? There are many ways to cut down on one's use of fossil fuels besides eating locally. Like bike commuting for instance, using solar power. If we as a society were forced to ration someday due to diminishing oil supplies, I'd like to think that ensuring healthy raw food to those in cold climates would be a top national priority (let's cut down some on the gas-guzzling military budget instead). ;)

That said, since becoming aware of these issues, I have made it a point to consciously amp up my consumption of local food. I belong to a community farm here in upstate NY where I get all my non-fruit staples from June through November. I have a garden out back. I support other local farms on a regular basis too, for instance, we have a lot of pick-your-own farms around here and we go berry picking about once a week. Right now it's blueberry season, in the fall it's apples, raspberries, and pumpkins. The health food stores here sell local food as well.

Still, I think it would be REALLY COOL to do, say, a 30-day local raw food challenge. Just as an experiment. I'm not sure how I'd replace those banana calories though (I eat from 3-6 a day). Are nuts commercially grown in the Northeast? I have no idea.