View Full Version : Contradicting answers
05-25-2006, 05:51 PM
Hi again everyone! I have a few questions if that is okay? :) If you have read my threads before you probably know what I am going through (overdosing on vitamin A, weight questions ect.). Anyway I wanted to get some other veiws to a few things, I just talked to David Klien Publisher of "Living Nutrition Magazine", well anyway I gave him my daily food intake and he said I was eating way to much fat, I mean enough for a week he said, and I said I am trying to gain weight so why is it such a problem, he said to eat dates and banana's, and that fat would make me loose weight :confused: because it takes so long to digest, but my expeirence has been that you gain fat when you eat fat. He said he looses weight when he eats a lot of fat and when he has a low fat diet he gains more weight. What! :confused: I am so confused! Does anyone have any opinions they would like to share, cause I think I would loose weight on a low fat diet and I really can't afford to. Also when I said my body fat is 9% he said that's kinda high, umm I don't know if it's just me or something but I keep hearing women have to have from 10-12% body fat for them to function properly. What do you think?
If you have any answers or opinions to share I would love to hear!
I feel a little lost at the moment (controdicting information)!
05-25-2006, 06:19 PM
i was told at a local gym i go to that I have 11% body fat and that is good. I think I look flabby though but thats not the point. Both dates and bananas are high in cals and they are easily absorbed by the body. I wouldn't force myself to over eat on fats. I truely don't believe it is healthy. I think if you lowered the amount of fat and upped the about of carbs you'll beable to gain weight in a healthy way. and I mean eat several bananas and dates. not just one or two. but then again I only know what my body responds to and what I have heard other's say.
05-25-2006, 06:22 PM
I think that you could go back to Klein with these questions, and ask for a full explanation, I'm sure that he will help to clarify the matter.
I do not think that there is a contradiction here. Think for example about Atkins diet. That diet is high in fat, yet people lose weight on it. So eating lots of fat does not guarantee that you will put on weight. In fact, I've read many stories of people becoming skinny or even emaciated on raw while eating lots of fat.
I met several atheletes who eat mostly fruit, yet have well-built, muscular bodies (see for example http://www.charliesgym.info/wst_page2.html). They argue that fruit is the best fuel, and the best food if one wants to build their body. They also emphasize the importance of exercise. I've see before (no exercise + fruit) and after (exercise + fruit) photos of one fruitarian, which confirm that exercise is important in building a larger body. I certainly noticed that I do not become emaciated on fruit.
All the best,
05-25-2006, 09:50 PM
The average college female has a body fat percentage of 30% and most female athletes are between 12 and 15%. I don't think 9% is too high!!! Goodness!!!
05-25-2006, 10:10 PM
Hi again startootsie,
I went to living nutrition boards and read your (was it you???) question and David's response (http://www.livingnutrition.com/fwn/read.php?2,1443). I did not see him saying anywhere that 9% is kinda high. Now I am confused. :confused:
PS Less than 10% body fat is not uncommon in raw vegan females. I would not rely on cooked foodists statistics.
05-29-2006, 12:23 PM
Hi again! Not that was not my question on that form. I talked to him on the phone. He said he would check with this other person somewhere to see about women. I don't know, I think he might just know about men?
Thank you for your help!
05-29-2006, 12:34 PM
Well, I used to do a high fat, low carb diet, cooked and I lost alot of weight, but that was a million years ago, when I was very young, now I do the 100% raw thing, and I'm happy, although not thin (yet)
05-29-2006, 12:39 PM
Thanks for that link. :)
This is a very important topic for me as I am nearly a frutiarian meself!! (That is, if you count avos and nuts/seeds as a fruit, LOL!)
05-29-2006, 01:13 PM
I think it makes sense. Cooked fat yes you'll gain if you eat more of it, but raw fats are different. Your body requires fat to work and metabolise. The more (Good) fat you have it can rev up your metabolism. I agree that if you are trying to gain you have to have fat, but get a lot of calories from dates, bananas, ect. with higher calories. Not sure if I explained anything at all (it's in my head and i can't seem to get it out lol).
05-29-2006, 01:46 PM
He also said a high fat diet could cause brittle hair or loss of hair. Any experiences?
05-29-2006, 01:53 PM
LOW fat causes brittle hair and loss of hair, this has been proven by looking at your animals, you need oils and fats for your joints to move smoothly and your hair and skin to shine, otherwise you have to add all kinds of stuff on the outside, that dosn't work, it just makes you addicted to it, like chapstick, lotions, conditioners, detanglers, shampoos, oh gosh, I'm on a roll again.
05-29-2006, 02:10 PM
Thank you for all this information and help! So are you saying you cannot loose hair or have brittle hair from a high fat diet? I used to eat no fat hardly at all and I had a huge dry skin rash all over my neck going up to my ears, and my hands would get so dry they would crack, I thought it was the heat cause I moved to a hot place but as soon as I started eating way more fat this has gone away.
Thank you again!
05-29-2006, 06:00 PM
Well, my personal hair experience on raw was that my hair got brittle after being raw for the first 6-9 months, and I experienced some dramatic hair loss for a couple of weeks, Later on, I (spontaneously) progressed to a high-fruit diet, and ever since then my hair has been actually better than before, when I was eating lots of nuts etc. I think that problems with hair can have various underlying causes (including detox), but it is not all about fat. I believe that my hair is better now not because I eat less fat, but because I eat more fruit. :)
05-29-2006, 06:15 PM
In my opinion, Klein is right. Increasing your fats will increase your calories, yes, but not you nutrition. If you eat more greens and fruits you are increasing nutrients ALONG with calories, which will feed muscle. From personal experience, eating more fats will only constipate, not help gain weight. If you really want to gain weight, whip out that juicer and drink an extra pint or two of green juices every day... this helps me when I want to add some muscle, not fat... I don't think anyone wants extra fat but I could be wrong.
05-30-2006, 05:28 PM
on the body fat % - anything below 18% is considered lean for a woman and once a women drops below about 12% many will stop menstruating. For men it is differed - below about 12% is considered lean though I have a male friend whois 4% body fat and looks great - lean does not mean small - it just means low body fat.
Like has been said earlier the average women is about 30 % body fat (though this is not healthy) and athleteic women are often in the low to mid teens.
05-30-2006, 07:55 PM
If you have any answers or opinions to share I would love to hear!
David Klein is a natural hygienest, they believe in mostly fruit, very low fat diet. Some people eat this way and feel great, some people have eaten this way and they felt lousy, it didn't work for them. So, I really have no advice, just wanted to say to listen to your own body, try different things, see what works for you.
05-31-2006, 04:05 PM
I do try to listen to my body, although I have puched my body so far in the past and gone so off track by not listening to my body that now I don't know if it's telling me something or my head. I am recovering right now and am having a hard time figuring out how to balance things out. I have tried to eat a lor of fruit but I feel terrible on to much fruit! I feel so good when I eat the right amount of fat and a lot of salads and more protein!
05-31-2006, 04:21 PM
i don't know whats best for you but i'll chime in with my personal experience so you may add it to your research and make your own decision. i got painfully (to look at) thin on high fat raw and couldn't start gaining again, regardless amount of calories until i did a couple short fasts and low fat, high fruit diet. by the way, i always had pimples, dry skin and dandruff but mainly lethargy when fatty but now my skin, hair, energy, etc have never been better. i've been raw now total almost 2 years. probably ~1.5 years high fat and just recently (1/2 year, or bit more) fruity. from what i've read "teens" is considered optimal for women as far as body fat, i assume thats 13-19%.
hope any of that can be helpful. please post back and share your decisions and teach us something new!
edit: i will be fair and not say 'always' had those problems on high fat raw, because when i first went raw it was a miracle and all my ailments went away and energy soared no matter what i ate raw - only after a year or so did the problems start coming back - after i was rid of any extra body fat.
05-31-2006, 04:37 PM
Thank you for sharing your expeirence's! Right at this moment I have put myself in quit a jam, I don't know why but I really want something but then for some reason I make an obsticle in my way so I have to wait!
Anyway I am trying to stay away from foods with vitamin A in them which leaves me with hardly anything! I miss salad so deeply right now! But the more I stay away from it and let it clean out of my body the more th symptoms go away so I am trying this at the moment.
Thank you again! :)
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