I'm a little scared

[twinyoga]

I feel like I have a love/hate relationship with raw foods. I have no problem eating all raw, I really don't even crave the cooked foods. But I feel so rebellious and bad at times! My husband really doesn't care what I do as long as I'm healthy but he does not want to eat raw. My twins are eating the meals I cook my husband (which is mainly vegetarian, whole food dishes...lots of soups).

Anyway, I just get so nervous. Am I getting enough calcium? Am I eating too much fat (from nuts, seeds, nut butters, avocados)...especially since I'm use to eating low fat diets. I'm not worried about protein, I'm not worried about iron and other minerals.

I feel good on raw, I just don't feel "normal". Normal as in what everyone eats. My family raised me on a very healthy SAD meals and I'm pretty darn healthy, so why do I want to do this? When I ask myself that, I think because I want to feel clean, feel light, I love the taste of fruits and veggies, and my blood sugar is good. But what will happen long term?

No one really cares what I eat, as long as I am healthy. So why am I so scared?

Finally, I realize there are much more important things in my life than what I eat for my meals...such as my babies, my family and friends, the real tragedies people are facing every day for plain survival (such as the Tsunami).

This has turned into a bit of a vent, too. But I just lose perspective so easily and scare myself. Has anyone been through this? Any suggestions? Is raw what's best for me?

Thanks so much. You're a great group of people.
Debbie

[Fruitloop]

Hi Debbie,
I know what you are talking about. This happens to me many times on my journey and as a matter of fact that is the one reason I have not been able to 100% for a long time. I would go back and forth. Finally I decided to do it and I promised myself I will be 100% for one year no matter what. I realized that I have to see for myself, not what other people think about it or consider normal. I had my own reason why I wanted to and so do you and that is always what I try to remember, why I am really doing it. I assume you practice yoga. I do to. The experience we have after a yoga class is very similar to eating a raw diet. And I think that is why we like to eat that way. Because we don’t want that feeling we just got to go away. Try not to judge your diet if it is too fat or too that. Trust your body and give it what it needs. Hope this helps some.

Fl ;)

[Sharon in Colorado]

Hi Debbie,

A lot of things and questions come to mind, for one,

How long have you been raw?

... if you just started eating raw within the past few months there shouldn't be cause for worry. It is very unlikely that you'll develop a defiency in just a few months.

What was your diet mainly before eating raw?

...what you ate regularly before going raw will tell you if you were already deficient in a nutrient. You could have been eating all starches and very little greens, and not getting enough quality protein and minerals like calcium.

I think most people already aren't getting true first hand quality nutrients and then when they go raw, feel some detox and get tested, and come to find out there's a defiency which the raw diet will get blamed on. How do they really know it wasn't their primary diet to begin with. I've read that meat eaters often have more problems with B12 deficiencies than vegetarians.

What are you eating on a daily basis now?

...this will tell you what kind of nutrients you are taking in...leading to the next question...

Have you tried entering your daily diet on www.fitday.com?

...entering in your foods will give you an analysis of all your calonutrients and vitamins, minerals and such. You'll see how much fat you are eating, and know if you are eating too much fat that would inhibit your nutrient absorption as well (I believe most of us eat too much fat, especially in the beginning of eating raw with all of our transitional foods).

I hope that helps, and if anything might put your mind at ease. There are blood tests you can take that tell you what nutrients you have and if there's enough of this and that in your body, but keep in mind that if you are new to raw, it wouldn't necessarily be the raw food if you have any deficiencies, and also if you have been a vegetarian for a period of time your levels might be okay if they are a little off, as opposed to the standard meat-eaters levels that they use as the standards to gauge the tests with.

[Olive]

Hi Debbie,

I'm right there with you! It can be so easy to get caught up in fear when we do something outside the norm. I think as humans we have a built in resistance (and attraction as well) to breaking the mold, which makes sense because it used to be that if you broke the mold too much, you'd be ousted from your community, which could mean death. I think it's totally natural to fear new things, especially when they are around food--already something so emotionally charged. We get trained to believe that if we eat a little bit of everything (including animal products), that we won't have nutritional deficiencies. So when you start cutting things out and changing patterns, you're going against ingrained messages. I know for myself that I get a sense of unease sometimes with raw foods. Like they could never satisfy me, never nourish me enough. But if I'm rational about it and listen to my intuition as well, I know that isn't true. For me, it was helpful to write down my doubts and look at them in the light of day. Were they logical fears? How could I get more information so that I felt my decisions were good ones?

Hope this was helpful,

Olive

[twinyoga]

Thanks to all of you for sharing. To answer some of the questions from Sharon:

I was strict vegetarian and almost all vegan before becomeing pregnant in the fall of 2003. I was doing very well with it and was a bit anemic but it was not diet related. My gastroentologist checks my blood twice a year and said I was fine. When I was pregnant with the twins I added more dairy and had animal protein about 12 times. Mostly I ate a lot of nut butters! Yum. Oh and pizza. I craved it. I had a healthy pregnancy though I had preterm labor and was on bedrest the last two months. I delivered two very health babies (boy and girl) last March. They are amazing! Since giving birth (breast fed only the first month) I wanted to go raw right away but it was just to stressful. Anyway, the most I've been raw was for 6 days and I loved it. But I was scared. Lately, I've made it three days.

Here's my average day (I'll give you yesterdays menu):
Breakfast, fruit bowl of an orange, 1/2 apple, 1/2 pear, 1/2 banana, some raisins and about 10 soaked almonds with a dressing of 1 banana blended with a little water and tahini.
Lunch, the second 1/2 of the apple and pear and about 5 brazil nuts, lots of water, a yoga practice and then a larabar and some more raisins (I've been craving raisins)
Dinner, spinach salad with mushrooms, carrots, cauliflower, vinegar, cashews and some raisins.
Dessert...a couple spoonfuls of honey.



I lean towards fruit more than vegetables...can you tell? I will try the fitday.com

I just want to relax and enjoy life...not obsess over what I eat!

Thanks,
Debbie

[askcassyfirst]

I totally understand your situation Debbie. I wanted to quickly say that I agree that you would benefit from using a nutrient calculator, or working with a nutritionist. I constantly see people in my line of work, (I am an NC) who dont realize that what they think they are eating is something totally different than what is going in the mouth. If you were to calculate the numbers, it would be very impowering to you, I think.

Personally, I eat about 80% raw year round, and have since 2003. I always worry about fat levels too, since my diet tends toward about 45% fat when I do all raw. It is due to the coconuts and avocados. I have had long times of 100%, as was the first 6 months of my journey. But when I do the 100% program, I usually eat a lot of fat and fiber. It is what I like to consume of produce...

Like I wrote in my journal, all raw is a great cleansing diet, but personally, I don't think that it is the only way to achieve optimal health. I look at many health "gurus" like Bragg who ate mostly raw, but did incorporate the occasional steamed veggies, raw dairy or bread. That is not to say that they were perfect, no one is, only there is danger in becoming obsessive or fanatical. This is the case in all things in life. So, if you are not confortable, look at why. Ask yourself why you feel this way, take time to "listen" to the answers. You may be doing all raw to heal, to cleanse, to clear your bowels, etc...Or even, to thrive. That is just a difficult road, but not impossible.

There are some pretty influencial people in the raw community who are not 100% 100% of the time. Check out this link: http://www.rawplus.com/rawarticles/fred.html

You are right, there are many things in life besides eating. For me, that is what raw has helped. I have a lot of obsessive issues around health, so that when I eat high raw, I feel better, and know that the chances for many of those "hypochondriac" moments is lower...I am less afraid to eat things that affect me negatively. But then, I can't always be in places where I have access to high quality raw food. So, I compromise. And that is ok for me.

I hope that helps. You can feel content in knowing that we are here to support you when you need to vent. As well as to boost you up when you need it too!

You can keep up the journey.... :o

Cassy

[twinyoga]

Thanks Cassy. Last week I did raw really well. I ate 100% raw from breakfast up till dinner. At dinner I would eat raw with some cooked (basmati rice, whole grain bread, cooked soup) and then back to raw if I wanted to snack before bed. It worked great. That is what I need to do. I don't think I need to be 100% raw, though a day here and there (even a week or so) would be beneficial. I love steamed veggies and tofu and I don't think I need to give that up.

Your advice was very helpful. Thanks, again!

[twinyoga]

I entered what I ate yesterday (100% raw) into fitday.com. This is what it came up with:

Calories Eaten Today
source grams cals %total
Total: 1540
Fat: 53 478 32%
Sat: 7 61 4%
Poly: 11 103 7%
Mono: 32 286 19%
Carbs: 253 865 58%
Fiber: 36 0 0%
Protein: 36 145 10%
Alcohol: 0 0 0%

Can someone comment on this? Am I doing ok?

I just want to add that this is the most supportive group I have ever met. Thank you so, so, so much.

Debbie

[askcassyfirst]

Hi. I am off to bed since it is quite late here on the east coast, but I wanted to quick reply to your Q about your data...

There are MANY if not hundreds of different philosophies when it comes to choosing the right combinations of the macro nutrients, but just so you will know, the figures will also need to relate to your height and weight, activity level, etc. It will also depend on if you are all raw or otherwise. Most raw food gurus would say that you can't apply cooked food theory to the raw diet.

That being said, I tend to er on the side of Patrick Holford, who wrote "The Optimum Nutrition Bible," a great book, that is very well respected. He encourages a diet high in fiber, low in protein, high in fresh produce, and vegetarian. He compares the following diets both ancient & modern:

Caveman Diet
carb 65%
fat 18%
protein 17%

Peasant
carb 70%
fat 13%
protein 12%
sugar 5%

Modern Man
carb 28%
fat 40%
protein 12%
sugar 20%

Ideal
carb 70%
fat 15%
protein 15%

I like the latter. This is of course based on a cooked vegetarian diet, so you can't apply it to raw. My suggestion would be to look at that thought, and see how you feel. Most raw foodists will have to have higher fat in order to incorporate calorie dense foods to make sure they are reaching thier caloric requirement...ever try eating 2000 calories of oranges? It is possible, I know that the 80-10-10 crowd does have it's followers. But that didn't work for me. I was too spacy from the sugars.

When raw, take today for instance, I was carb 51%, fat 39%, protein 8%. I do try to keep my fat low, but on 100% The fat tends to rise....I don't beat myself up, since this day I only intook about 1400 calories. You can't help having a high fat percentage when you eat a whole avocado and cashews & still keep your total calories under 1600! when I was all raw it was nothing to eat an entire mature brown coconut in a day amoung the rest of my food....that was over 1300 in calories alone, and mostly fat and fiber.



Just some thoughts.

Cassy

[Sharon in Colorado]

It looks like all you need are a cup or two of grapes or 1-2 bananas and you'll get your fat down and carbs up a little bit. I wouldn't worry about it, because it's hard not to over-eat fat at first. I think too, that naturally most folks who do this over time want the lighter stuff after a while, which means a lot more fruits and salads and less nuts and flax crackers!

You are doing great, getting lots of fruit (vitamins & fiber)... you should be proud of your progress!

[Sweet lips]

Twinyoga,

Hold up, wait a minute :) I am no expert here, but I have a little sumpin, sumpin under my belt and Fruit loop and Olive both hit is square dead in the middle. It is different, and we have been taught in some venues that different is not good.

I have a very strong personality, however, I am inclined at this time to follow the advice of Alissa and others who I have deemed knowledgeable enough to advise me with what comes with the Raw Challenge, as was this board designed. I just want to be taught, I need to follow for awhile.

Am I willing to count my calories, break it down by fat, protein and carbs, no. I realized that is not the way for me - I have done that traditionally, and I am not succesful with healing - I always feel I have an out. Am I at some type of risk, my heart says no, follow the path and see.

I am used to the unusual and the unexplained because of my faith - I beleive in someone that I have never physically seen, who I have been told came because of me some 2000 years ago, and I beleive it- bottom line! Someone may say something that is contrary to my beleif. It is okay. I have seen miracles happen that just can't be explained by anyone, and so I say this to say, if you choose to be raw as this board is about about then try to take out the fear factor and relax your mind. If you feel well doing this, then continue, if you do not, then use your choice of medical care to determine what is going on with you.

I nursed my son for a long time and he did not have any solid food for the first 8 months of his life, - at birth he weighed 9lbs 13 oz, he was not a diabetic baby, he had no problem, smooth skin, very alert and of course people teased us about the big baby in the nursery. He was a calm baby and he grew accordingly without any trouble. (God knows we know) Was that the norm, not in mainstream, did he suffer, actually, not at all, were there benefits, We see them now, he is 17 years old, 6"1, 220 and a whole heap of natural muscles - we joke in the household about he has had 4 colds in his entire life, and never once an ear infection that is common to small children ( and that is considered the norm - ear infections.) He has been raised a vegetarian, and right now he does eat cheese, and so I hear some mucous some mornings. OUr method of raising Andrew was so different than the typical African American family, and that did not stop us, we did what we felt was best. Not realizing it then, but he had a high raw diet- I pureed all of his fruit and many veggies in their natural state, and once my mil thought I was crazy, cause his food didn't come from a jar, until she tasted his meal and I never added salt and my sweetners were fruits and raisins. I was afraid to use anything else. [I had to edit that - because I can imagine a few raised eyebrows about salt]

Is 100% Raw best for you? Are you able to do as Alissa commented on Yanni this week, just do it , essentially without being able to accurately quote, she said, don't worry about calories, fats and proteins, do it.

Relax Debbie, in your heart you know the answers you want - as Fruitloop talked about in yoga - it helps you define your center, it is nothing wrong with not being raw 100% if that is where you are- you have to try, and let the fear factor not be the priority, but the catalyst to move forward - Faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not known. You decide from your heart and be blessed by your decision.

Do you leave this board, I wouldn't think so, as you are on a journey, who knows through the testimonies, the discussion, something may be there to help you determine you heart and allow you to get to meat of the matter.

[askcassyfirst]

I wanted to add a bit to my last post, since I spent some time reading over others subsequent notes to mine.

I hope you were able to see that I was not advocating that you disregard the journey to becoming all raw, or even that you should spend everyday entering your food into a food calculator. What I wanted to express was that using such a calculator gave me comfort when I went 100%, in order to achieve that "relaxation" and "trust" that I wanted, and that boards like this hope to inspire.

I think that for some it is easy to just say "relax", but it is nice when you have numeric proof to show yourself, and family that you are "being taken care of." In fact, in my case it was quite empowering. I also recall that the original post title contained the word "SCARED". I think fear is a STRONG sensation, a powerful one, that we CAN conquer, and which often needs strategy. My post was directed as a way to assuage such fears....

That is not to say that I spend everday using the calculator, once I learned what was sufficient, I don't need it to the same extent. Also, I think we all need to take the journey that is comfortable for us, and if the nutrient calculator is my comfort, than I say I can use it, untill I break free from that tie too.

I hope that makes sence. I totally agree with Alissa in that we need to "Just do it!"' I was just sharing how I DO it....I think that in community, we can inspire one another to grow...

Cass

[Sweet lips]

Miss Cass,

I do hope that you did not think my post was directed at you since it was subsequent. I responded to Twinyoga as well about her fear. She was on my heart this morning and I wrote it to her understanding how debiltating fear can be. Please take my comments as that - because I as well, explained in my writing my choices for what I am doing now- " Am I willing to count my calories, break it down by fat, protein and carbs, no. I realized that is not the way for me - I have done that traditionally, and I am not succesful with healing - I always feel I have an out. Am I at some type of risk, my heart says no, follow the path and see. "

I too was sharing HOW I DO it ;)

[Sharon in Colorado]

Just wanted to add after the commentary that while www.fitday.com is an excellent tool, it certainly doesn't need to be used every single day & you absolutely do not need to be a slave to it.

Sometimes I don't realize how much fat I'm taking in until I actually punch it in to fitday and then I realize "whoa...I really didn't have to eat a whole avocado...and it wouldn't have hurt to take in some extra fruit..." It's like what they say at many of these weight loss centers, it's the licks and bites that you don't realize build up, and then you are plateauing in your weight-loss or your health challenges aren't improving as quickly anymore. You learn why.

It just doesn't hurt to punch in your daily diet a few times. Then you get an idea of what you are eating and you don't have to do it all the time. Just in the beginning anyway.

[Alissa]

OH MY!
Ok first let me just say olive, your response was so true talking about the fear.
Sharon, i love what you said about 'How long have you been raw? And that it is very unlikely that you'll develop a deficiency in just a few months. And also when you asked 'What was your diet mainly before eating raw?'
My personal pet peeve, people blaming things on the raw diet after being on it a month (eating healthy fruits and veggies) as opposed to what they have been eating for the past 10 years. Aughghgh! (twin yoga - im not saying you are doing this)
Sweet lips, i love what you said! Believing, having faith, seeing the miracles and how can you deny that! But most of all this line...
‘Am I willing to count my calories, break it down by fat, protein and carbs, no. I realized that is not the way for me - I have done that traditionally, and I am not successful with healing - I always feel I have an out.’
Twin yoga, first of all i know you mean when you say 'there is so much more to life then figuring out and obsessing over food.' i totally agree. And if you feel you have found the best way for you that is wonderful.

Maybe this should be directed to cassy… i think that to have to analyze every morsel of food that goes into you mouth and worry that you are deficient therefore entering your food into a computer everyday or (even once a month!) would be a nightmare!!!! At least to me!

My god people, just eat raw, really i can’t stress this enough, that’s why i loved yani's letter to me, just do it!

I see people with major illnesses that nothing else has helped, i see obese people and people with minor aches and pains all do raw and have amazing results! They heal themselves of all of these things when nothing else has worked! I have NEVER worked with someone who this diet has not worked for. Ok, please don’t send me a million emails, those of you who think this diet is not working for you, because i know, (from reading post and years of counseling people) that many of you will say, 'well, im raw and i haven’t had these amazing results.' But when i work with people who say this i ALWAYS find out they are eating some cooked food, have 'cheated' on their diet, or have something to that effect going on. I know this is a bold statement to say that everyone i have ever seen go 100%, let me repeat that, 100% raw, yes again 100% RAW it has worked. You can doubt me all you want, but it’s the truth. Those of you who are thinking well, im 100% raw for a month or two and its not working for me, then you need to talk to someone and get some guidance or give it some time. Another pet peeve, thinking your body will heal itself within a week after 30 years of abuse. Sometimes it does but sometimes it’s going to take a while. But... if your not RAW it cant work! Don’t say that raw is not working if you’re not even DOING IT!!!!!!!! Whew... ok, I got off on a tangent there, sorry, but it’s just so aggravating sometimes. If you are hurting, or sick and tired or overweight and you are going off and on raw or if you decide like twin yoga did to eat mostly raw but with some healthy cooked, that’s fine, but don’t say this diet doesn’t work if your not even doing it!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Getting back on track... twin yoga, i think its great that you are eating what you feel is best for you. Like i have said if you have to white knuckle it it’s not worth the stress, as that is more detrimental to your health. If you are healthy, have no illness, do not need to lose weight, feel as if this suits you etc… then all the best.
If however the people, like most everyone here on the board are trying to eat raw, let me just say this....
STOP COUNTING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! If you need more information, if your not clear on where you get your calcium, etc. read, investigate, educate yourself, but, and This is me yelling... STOP COUNTING EVERYTHING YOU PUT INTO YOUR MOUTH!!!!! That is the magic and the beauty of this diet. You don’t have to do that! Like olive said, start using your intuition. This is about your health and your life. Forget about what has come before; forget about what conventional diets have taught you, they obviously haven’t worked have they????? So why keep repeating the same way that hasnt been working!
Yes, this is different and not what the mainstream way is, but do you want to be like the mainstream? Look around you! Do you want to be one of the sheep or are you ready to be you, the true you who has the power and ability to change the way you feel and the ability to heal yourself and feel the best you possibly can? Ill leave this rambling with two quotes that i have in my book.

There are no “incurable” diseases. If you are willing to take responsibility for yourself and your life, you can heal yourself of anything.
Dr Richard Schultze

Mark Twain: `whenever you find that you are on the side of majority, it’s time to pause and reflect.’ Even back then Mark Twain knew that just because you are different doesn’t mean you are wrong.”

[greengirl]

Alissa, I'm so glad to read your response! The beauty of this way of life (for me) is that I don't have to constantly calculate fat grams, calories, carbs or whatever number in my head! This is the way I want to live the rest of my life, and the simpler, the better (for me). Like you said in your book, this way of eating has "set me free"! When I first discovered the raw thing, I thought I would slowly ease into it... but then it was so easy and came so naturally that I just said to myself, why not just be 100% raw right now? Anyway, I'm straying from the subject here! Just wanted to back up Alissa.

[FEELIN'GOOD]

Wow... my jaw is to the floor! Alissa, I think you were 'yell typing' - you go girl! We need your fire! Whew... thank you! :D

[twinyoga]

Wow. I didn't expect to see all these responses when I turned on my computer today.

Thanks to everyone (especially Alissa for chiming in. I have a lot to think about.. but not dwell on.

You are all a great group of people and I thank you so much for your suggestions.

I even spoke a little to my holistic doctor today and got similar advice from him.

All of you made such good points whether you eat 80% or 100%.

Like I said earlier, I am fortunate to not have any major illnesses but want to thrive and have energy for my family! I want to feel good and light and balanced.

Gotta go find where my twins have crawled off to.
Debbie

[Alissa]

;) look what you started!
Gave us a good thread to learn from!
Best,
Alissa

[askcassyfirst]

This really is a great thread, so much enthusiasm and energy. This means people really are feeling what it is that they are saying...

I just wanted to say, that there is no doubt in my mind that all my counting would indeed make some peoples eyes spin... Even my husband giggles at me. But it has been something that has helped me see things that I needed to see. As the type of person I am, I like to see the nutrient values. It is something I started back when I was into working out doing body building. Obsessive? Maybe. But in this this context it is helpful: I do like having the record though, it is a food diary that I have been able to use to track down as my aches and pains and illness disappeared. In a way, it is my testimony to raw. I recorded the first 4 months, and then maybe a few weeks here or there since 2003. I am duely recording this 30 day challange now.

I wrote in my journal that raw "cured'" some health issues I suffered from. I will detail that here. I "had" fibroid and Poly Cystic Ovaries, which after 4 months raw, my practitioner couldn't find any more! That is a true testament to the healing power of raw foods. I was also walking to stimulate my lymph, and drinking gallons of water. It is interesting looking back at my food diary from that time, because I can see that caffiene was probably the hardest to cut out, but the best for my health. Even now, when I drink it, I see my symtoms returning.

Anyway, I just thought Id share that. I agree with you Alissa, one can't knock raw if they aren't doing it. I guess I never even considered that is what the thread was implying...I remember at my last job where my boss always used to rant about protein. It got so bad that I would go home for lunch, but she would still question did I eat any egg or fish...She constantly questioned the raw way, and yet she had never even tried it. Your point is well taken!

:) :) :)
CASSY