Brush myself off... start all over...

[Queenie]

Fell off the wagon today. I didn't eat any starches but I ate some soup and some other things... We have free catered food at work and I just have not been able to feel full on the raw food. Hungry hungry hungry and I am also a little upset...

Had a run-in with a man. I'm having a few I Hate Men, Men Are All a Bunch of Sexist Pigs moments.

I know this is a mixed board and my apologies to the Mens who post here. I go through this from time to time... the men in my family and then the men in the world... plus the women who support the double and triple standards and are just as willing to use the b-word as the men... The b-word has been used on me a lot it seems and I just can't take it after a while.

Anyone else find that emotional pain triggers this sort of binge?? I want to eat till I pass out and maybe drink some wine. I know I won't... I'm done with the cooked food but jeez. Hit me broadside why dontcha...

[sport]

If you give in and weaken then the person that has upset you has won a double victory.
The only person that suffers when you eat cooked food is you. By eating it you are allowing them to hit you twice. Rise above it. After you have done it a few times it will become second nature to you.

[misslinda]

WOW, Queenie, what a day for you!!!! :eek:

I can relate to some of your feelings and intesity---also the things you are not saying ;)

At one time, I was selling cars and I thought being the only female that I thought I'd be surrounded by men of class considering it was a luxury dealership. Let's just say that ALL the horror stories you hear about these men, THEY ARE TRUE and EVEN WORSE when you work there. So, I have been there at one time dealing with the "other species" and despising them etc. It took alot out of me to figure out why I was affected by it all.

I'm sorry it is causing you triggers to binge.........can I ask what does "run in" mean? Sounds like you're alot more frustrated than your saying? How do the male friends or male family members react to your episodes?

To say that you feel like eating til you pass out and then drink some wine is serious statement.............what have you been thinking and feeling since then?

:( keep us posted.

[Queenie]

Sport and Misslinda, I appreciate both of your responses very much.

I don't really feel like trying to describe the episode. It was just one of those encounters in which I felt invalidated and patronized. He's an older man who is kind of stuck - I think - in that whole judeo-christian paradigm of the man's supremacy. I felt like I left myself open, so there was an element of self-destruction there as well. The thing is, I was BORN to question and challenge those BS male-supremacy patriarchal beliefs. I bring it to their attention and they don't like it. So they say things to invalidate me. I don't know why, but it gets me riled every time. Possibly because my pseudo-liberal Dad and brother do the SAME THING all the time!

As to the food, it was sort of a knee-jerk reaction. You will be happy to hear that I went home that evening and had a green smoothie and some nice, nourishing rawness, no cooked! Today everything so far has been raw (though I did have a cup of coffee... bad... another thing I do when I have unpleasant feelings to deal with).

Upward and onward. I refuse to allow a couple of setbacks to put me off the path. Being Raw is a great journey!

Thanks again for your kind words. Cheli

[karenisraw]

misslinda,

I had a friend who sold cars at a dealership in Colorado, and she said the same thing about the men. Also she said they were soooooo aggressive. The men who post here don't have to feel bad. I love men and think they are adorable. There are some out there (as well as women) who are real works of art.

k

[JMD]

Queenie..

I can totally relate--eating to harm myself over others opinions and transgressions with me. Sums up my entire childhood and 20's almost....


Hang in there and a great piece of advice I got was to NOT react to anything or make major decisions when one is in a low mood---wait until the mext morning to do such things....

JHang in there...men are supposed to be different than women...but do NOT accept unacceptable behavior!!

Blessings and I am sending you calming prayers (((((( ))))))))
JMD

[misslinda]

Sport and Misslinda, I appreciate both of your responses very much.

I don't really feel like trying to describe the episode. It was just one of those encounters in which I felt invalidated and patronized. He's an older man who is kind of stuck - I think - in that whole judeo-christian paradigm of the man's supremacy. I felt like I left myself open, so there was an element of self-destruction there as well. The thing is, I was BORN to question and challenge those BS male-supremacy patriarchal beliefs. I bring it to their attention and they don't like it. So they say things to invalidate me. I don't know why, but it gets me riled every time. Possibly because my pseudo-liberal Dad and brother do the SAME THING all the time!

As to the food, it was sort of a knee-jerk reaction. You will be happy to hear that I went home that evening and had a green smoothie and some nice, nourishing rawness, no cooked! Today everything so far has been raw (though I did have a cup of coffee... bad... another thing I do when I have unpleasant feelings to deal with).

Upward and onward. I refuse to allow a couple of setbacks to put me off the path. Being Raw is a great journey!

Thanks again for your kind words. Cheli


Pffffew. SOOOOOO glad to hear you are pulling thru........sorry, I wasn't trying to pride into your situation. Great to hear you working thru it and never be sorry for being open and honest. ;)

Karen, LOL..........I was a pretty aggressive woman myself but I was so tired of having to argue with petty stupid stuff like "Linda's heels are too loud" are beign yelled at for not lying to customer's or fighting over commissions that I knew were mine. I got to the poin that I was taking 1 hour demo rides :D Yes, men at their worst. I agree, men are wonderful creatures and there are good ones out there.

:)

[Shivananda]

I have a different take on your situation... I don't thing you have to start anything over, even if you could actually do that, and I don't think you did anything wrong. You just did what you did.

It's already in the past. But dwelling on it, and beating yourself up for it just keeps dragging that past into the present moment. So you're doing more than just punishing yourself, you're actually condemning yourself to the punishment of living that incident over and over again (kinds like "Groundhog Day," eh?) , at least until you get sick of telling the story, or everyone else does.

To repeat, you did nothing wrong. You just did what you did. And giving yourself the excuse that you did what you did for a darned good/bad/indifferent reason... "I was soooo upset that I just had to eat nachos!" or "That bad man, he makes me so crazy I lose all control!" are really just smokescreens, covering up the simple fact that you made the choice to eat the food you did, even though it wasn't what you say you are committed to. Now what there is to do is to declare that breakdown complete, and recommit to eating raw and moving forward. Right now. This instant.

And as hard as it can be to get this at first (I know, I really do, I've been there myself), if you master this way of dealing with yourself and your upsets, you'll progress much faster through generating the changes you want to see in your own life, and in the universe around you.

[Queenie]

Again, everyone, thanks for the helpful words... and ladies... How did you ever survive the car dealerships without going postal?! It sounds awful...

I agree that I made the choice but many of us make food choices for emotional reasons. I mean, you don't go diving for a bar of chocolate because you're being rational. Sometimes one just isn't rational. I can guarantee you, Shiv, have never been premenstrual (as I am now) - believe me, it defies translation.

[Shivananda]

To stop being the victim of racism, or sexism, or ageism, or any other "ism," you personally have to stop being a racist, sexist, ageist, or whatever yourself. As Ghandi said, "You must be the change you wish to see in the world."

Bashing men because you feel a particular male individual (or even a group of men) has behaved badly towards you, I'm sorry to inform you, is sexist behavior. Not only does it not solve anything, I believe it actually increases the total mass of the issue. And then having others jump on the buddy pile with their own "isms" to add is very destructive to open communication, but apparently has been socially acceptable here for a while. In just a short time on this board I've found sexist comments about men to be surprisingly common here, and I've already heard other men comment about the same thing in other discussions, including one on why so few men particpate here.

I personally think it is time for some serious Spring Housecleaning around here. I say, let's all ditch the stereotypes about other people, at the same time we are endeavoring together to ditch our stereotypes about how to eat. I sincerely believe that will allow the RawFoodTalk board, and the whole Living on Live Food message to become more open and inviting to all.

And let's remind each other of that whenever we forget, or just fall back on habit, OK?

Besides, I'm not a sexist pig, I'm a sexy fig. You just heard it wrong. :D

[Nini]

Besides, I'm not a sexist pig, I'm a sexy fig.

HAHA!! You are one funny fig, too!

[misslinda]

I agree Shiv BUT in light of Queenie's present dealings and where she is at with these issues--emotional,physical and mental, she needs to work it out in her way that suits herself which is in her timing...........besides, shew as very open is saying that is wasn't meant to offend the men on this board. If a person CHOOSES to be offended, I think that is an issue of their own as well.


In my opinion, ff you reread her second post, she made TREMENDOUS progress. Her journey and her timing is her story.


Shiv, there may been sexist comments but that goes both ways......I've been here nealy 2 years and never encountered TRUE sexism-----in all fun and games, YES! If they happend, they are far and few in between.

:)

[Shivananda]

If they happend, they are far and few in between.

Let me just say that I read something here yesterday... I won't say when it was posted, or where... that just stopped me dead in my tracks. And it wasn't just the original post, it was the followup too. I had the thought... "Oh, ok, I see, this is a board for women. I suppose us few men who post here are just an accident, because the basic assumption clearly is that it's for women. How did I miss that?"

And that, I'm guessing, is the real reason more men don't post here. They just sense that, and don't stick around.

[Lady Green Jeans]

Shivananda,

Thank you for your posts. It is nice having varied opinions and open opinions. When I see that you have posted, I make sure to read them as I find well grounded (moreso than I am) thoughtful postings.

It is sad that the opinion is this is a female board. The male presence here is very important and balancing. I hope we get more.

[PATH301]

Lady Green Jeans,

It is sad that the opinion is this is a female board. The male presence here is very important and balancing. I hope we get more.
Gosh- Lady Green Jeans, you make me feel like Iam part of the club :D

Queenie,
Just so you know, me personaly I am not offended at all.
I've had to work for and with certain people that have at times made me want end their life,( this is a figure of speech, "like going postal"). Queenie has a great group of people hear that she can talk to and vent and change and grow.

Shivananda,

As Ghandi said, "You must be the change you wish to see in the world."

This is a great quote for a lot of purposes, but Ghandi, and myself and all the other men who saw this post but chose not to respond to it because we know that:
Queenie's
I can guarantee you, Shiv, have never been premenstrual (as I am now) - believe me, it defies translation.
Is the truth!

misslinda,

I agree Shiv BUT in light of Queenie's present dealings and where she is at with these issues--emotional,physical and mental, she needs to work it out in her way that suits herself which is in her timing...........besides, shew as very open is saying that is wasn't meant to offend the men on this board. If a person CHOOSES to be offended, I think that is an issue of their own as well

I agree with misslinda here, Queenie is working it out her own way she talking about it she asking for help from some of her female friends here on the board
She doesn't want to fall off the wagon and use sad food as a crutch, i think your doing a great job in handling this situation.
Again ladies This guy is not offended - I'm cool with it :D

[rawpriestess]

Let's all do our best not to bash anyone or any group.

Yes, we each can choose to react to statements.

So, let's keep this board a safe and secure place to be man or woman.

[Queenie]

Shivananda and everyone: I don't mean to guy-bash and I'm sorry if it seems this way. I'm expressing something I probably SHOULD express to only women. I've been running into a lot of patronizing, holier-than-thou attitudes from men lately, that's all, and since I already have issues with chauvinistic men it's bringing up some stuff. It never fails that a man gets his knickers in a twist. Men (and a lot of women) don't handle discussions of sexism very well and tend to go on the attack, which I guess I can understand.

I'm not attacking men, I'm attacking the paradigms. Most men I come across want to hold onto the illusion of supremacy and do not like it when I simply say, "this is not working for me." I'm not sexist, and I'm not playing the victim card, at least not for long. I'm going after some paradigms that need to go. Why do people get so alarmed?

I don't need anyone - man or woman - to fix me or adjust me or tell me what I need to do. Believe me, I have a very active spiritual life and I may not go about it the way some people do but it's not like I'm sitting here unaware. I honestly, truly, think a lot of people just cannot handle having the old belief systems challenged. That doesn't mean I can stop challenging them!

What I need to do has been obvious to me all along: I need to look at the smoking mirror and find out why I'm perpetually running into these attitudes. I'm dropping this now. This is a topic that I feel needs to be addressed but it never fails to get some really defensive reactions. Sorry if I offended people.

[rawpriestess]

PLEASE --- Let's get back to the original question


****************************
Anyone else find that emotional pain triggers this sort of binge?? I want to eat till I pass out and maybe drink some wine. I know I won't... I'm done with the cooked food but jeez. Hit me broadside why dontcha...

******************************
my answer is YES,
I do eat when there are emotional triggers, and it is my choice, although not a healthy one per se'

I'm sure I would be much better off, if I were to actually attempt to deal with my issues.

Queenie, you are very insightful, to realize that you have these issues, and that is why you are bringing them to you.

This is half the challenge to acknowledge and accept that we have issues.

[rawfigure]

To stop being the victim of racism, or sexism, or ageism, or any other "ism," you personally have to stop being a racist, sexist, ageist, or whatever yourself. As Ghandi said, "You must be the change you wish to see in the world."

Bashing men because you feel a particular male individual (or even a group of men) has behaved badly towards you, I'm sorry to inform you, is sexist behavior. Not only does it not solve anything, I believe it actually increases the total mass of the issue. And then having others jump on the buddy pile with their own "isms" to add is very destructive to open communication, but apparently has been socially acceptable here for a while. In just a short time on this board I've found sexist comments about men to be surprisingly common here, and I've already heard other men comment about the same thing in other discussions, including one on why so few men particpate here.

I personally think it is time for some serious Spring Housecleaning around here. I say, let's all ditch the stereotypes about other people, at the same time we are endeavoring together to ditch our stereotypes about how to eat. I sincerely believe that will allow the RawFoodTalk board, and the whole Living on Live Food message to become more open and inviting to all.

And let's remind each other of that whenever we forget, or just fall back on habit, OK?

Besides, I'm not a sexist pig, I'm a sexy fig. You just heard it wrong. :D


This is fabulous ! You deserve a big {{{{HUG}}}}, and go have a fig on me !

It is so true. I work in the world of Wall Street and I love the interactions we all have there, all of us together, alike and different. I have learned :

"You must be the change you wish to see in the world." !!! Yes Mr S..thanks for the reminder ! and....
"It is not what happens to you, but how you react to it is what is important"
and
"harboring bitterness against anyone hurts you more than it does that person, so never let the sun go down on your anger"....(I have to remind myself on this one from time to time... :rolleyes: )



I love the diversity of the board !

[Shivananda]

What I need to do has been obvious to me all along: I need to look at the smoking mirror and find out why I'm perpetually running into these attitudes.

For this, I'll go back to what I pointed at before. What I've learned and experienced is that spiritually, when you can't let go of something... just flat out accept it exactly as it is, and exactly as it is not... then you keep running into it, over and over and over.

What you resist persists. Trying to change something keeps it the same. Only what you accept can be transformed.

[lily]

What a thought-provoking exchange this has been. I can totally empathise with the pain from the female point of view -- but I personally found the 'sexy fig' take on the whole thing very empowering (thanks, Shivananda, it's always helpful to be reminded of this) -- to be empowerd, not to be a victim of anyone or any 'ism'. Inner peace, world peace, and all that... What was that well-known quote about the world is perfect but we just have to see that -- do you know it, Shivananda? It's helpful, but I've forgotten it!

lily